Exactly. People who blame our losing on lack of continuity and patience have absolutely no clue. Other than Pete Carroll, who did it 20 years later, not a single GM or coach the Jets have let go have gone on to do anything successful. Not one. In fact, there are multiple players who have gone to other places and had good and even great careers, which speaks volumes about the Jets ability to develop the players they draft. Bad continuity for the sake of continuity is far worse than no continuity.
The thing is, it's not like it would have been too quick to pull the plug on JD in 2024. People say, his 1st year doesn't count since he didn't get to draft, but the rookies from his first draft are already out of the rookie deals. The fans HAVE been patient. But we failed to win more than 7 games with him for 5 years now, and the year that "doesn't count" has the best winning %. Tanny was the Jets GM for 7 years, 5 had .500+ record, 3 play-off appearances, two conference championships. He made play-offs his 1st year, and went to AFC finals 4th and 5th year. Compare that to what we see from JD. Tanny was fired after 8-8 and 6-10 seasons, just after he went to back to back AFC finals. That (in average 7-9) record over the two years that got him fired is better than any season JD has had in his tenure here. An argument could be made that Tanny should have stayed. But, the goal was the SB, and Tanny didn't achieve it. JD's can't even sniff Tanny's results, and he gets his 6th year. What's even more ridiculous that Izdik, who was fired after two seasons, had a better season (8-8) than JD has ever had. And he also had a player he drafted win Rookie of the year (Shelden Richardson). Mac then was there for 4 years (and part of 5th, where he drafted Q), didn't make play-offs, but had one 10-6 season in 2015, and was actually named executive of the year that year. Looking at all of this, the only guy who actually got results lately was Tanny. Maybe a case could have been made to just keep rolling with him. Bother other than that... JD is getting significantly more opportunities than everyone else in spite of significantly inferior results to anyone else.
Consistency... Woody loves consistency now. So be it. The Jets continue to lose and the FO/CS continually gets mulligans. Wouldn't surprise me if Woody gives them all 5 yr. extensions for the sake of consistency.
Agree that it's not too soon to pull the plug from a performance standpoint, but if they are intent on running back with Rodgers, and you and I have had this discussion, you can't fire everybody now. It makes no sense and they would never attract anyone with any kind of decent ability or track record. It would just be running in the mud, and I'm sick of doing that. We have to suffer through one more year, after which everything will definitely blow up again, and then we can clean house from top to bottom.
No wonder JD grossly overpaid for Rodgers even when GB had no choice but to essentially take any offer the Jets had - looks like it was worth it for him personally as he saved his job. Screwed the fans in the process, but that's secondary. Let's just hope his dumb ass learned some lessons after this year, and the lesson not being let's do the same thing, but get different results, with better luck.
I still say that was 100% Woody's move. Douglas had a contract, he was getting paid either way, he wouldn't need to save his job. Why would he want to be at this shit show if he can get out and still get paid?
Because the longer he stays the more chance for a second contract. He can double his money. He could legitimately have just 1 somewhat decent year in 6, then get an extension, and he doubles up the $. Then he can really take it easy. What you saw before trade deadline (where is Roger Saffold btw) would be considered grueling hard labor compared to what he can do after that. As far as Woody, I am sure he wanted Rodgers, but I doubt he was forcing JD to blow his load prematurely with 3 days to go before the draft. JD just saw the $ for the second contract and could not last any longer, ejaculating all over the fan base.
be interested to know who is on that list? most high profile players that leave the Jets either crash out of the league or go on to have fairly unspectacular careers - struggling to think of any former Jets that have suddenly turned great (i.e. been bad with the Jets then become good) - I don't think the problem is failing to develop the players they draft I think the problem is they draft the wrong players (over and over again)
I disagree with that. The longer he stays and the more things fall apart, the more likely it is he gets fired. In order for him to get an extension, he would have to show some results, and as we've discussed many times, he hasnt exactly done that. It probably would have been more beneficial for him to get fired last year or even this year, while there's still some good thoughts about a couple of players he picked, he might be able to play the "Jets suck,Woody did this to me" into another job offer before all of his leverage is gone.
Lots of good points…however, pointing to Idzik and Mac’s win-loss records can be a bit deceiving. I don’t care what their records are, I think both guys are some of the worst GMs in the game, and among the worst we’ve had at the Jets…Idzik didn’t do anything groundbreaking…he freed up cap room by getting rid of Sanchez and Holmes. Mac wasted high picks on shit players at bad positions outside of Q. They did not know how to build. Idzik knew enough to clear up finances as he was from that side of the house, but he had a draft with a dozen picks and blew them all except Enunwa. He should have either traded up for better quality or traded out for future picks, but no team takes on 14 draft picks. Mac just ignored OL and tried to piece it together with low free agent signings… They both sucked. Granted, JD’s results on OL have been even worst than Mac’s probably, so there’s that, but from a strategic team building view, I think JD is better than both of those guys. He’s better in trades. Where he has failed is in the execution of the strategy…in sticking to some of his draft picks like Becton when it was clear to many that he was not going to be the answer…in sticking with Zach in a critical year when there was no track record to support that faith. But if we had to go into next year with one of Idzik, Mac, or JD, I’d choose JD every time. Again, not saying his track record doesn’t warrant a firing, because after 5 years, we should be better than we are. That I get. But I don’t think either Idzik or Mac are better only because their records were on par or better…
Mostly on the defensive side of the ball, no one on the offense has ever been worth a shit. And most of the time it hasn't been big stars it's been guys that have been ok, show some promise, not a system fit, etc, and go fulfill that promise elsewhere. Off the top of my head without doing any research at all, here's a short list: Jonathan Vilma, Demario Davis, Hugh Douglas (little further back), James Farrior. A couple of those guys were nice players with the Jets but turned into stars elsewhere. Again, no research at all, and I'm sure there are some guys here who know this stuff much better than I do we can point out some guys that have left and gone on to do well.
Yes, you can make an argument JD is better than these two, who didn't get the 5th year, or in Izdik's case a 3d year. But this is really splitting hairs. All three have been bad. Tanny was the only one who got results. I am really pissed off at JD mainly for this past off-season, not the other three, even though there was plenty of fuck ups there. I still think convincing Rodgers to come was a good move. It's not easy to get a good QB. But it just baffles me how a professional GM give up a 1st round pick swap and low 2024 protection so easily, when GB was in impossible situation with 110 mil guaranteed contract looming and a 60 mil check due in Sept and them already publicly committing to Love, and Rodgers saying he would only play for us, and the precedent already set with Favre. Then to follow that up ignoring the Tackle spot completely and relying on injured Duane Brown and other scrubs. Boyle and Siemien as back-ups with Wentz begging to come here. Complete inaction after Davis retired in mid August. Only Roger Saffold at the trade deadline (where is he btw) when Ezra Cleveland was available. It's just seems like JD got paralyzed after they convinced Rodgers to come. All I can tell you is that I hope he wakes up, because that last off-season he was asleep at the wheel at the time when we actually had a chance to be a good team. To me the fuck ups this off-season I described are unforgivable, I mean you can't piss away a season like that in NFL. And I have a legitimate concern that while he started decent, he then burnt out. I hope to be wrong.
Vilma was great when he was here - he didn't suddenly become good. I also thought of Davis as someone that was a decent player elsewhere but again not like he was bad with the Jets. If you're having to go back 20 odd years to find a couple of possible candidates then I stick by my position that the problem for the Jets is picking the wrong players in the first place rather than failing to develop them as none of our draft busts have gone on to be great somewhere else that I can think of (compared to a huge list of first and second round draft busts)
They realized after year 2 of Zach they had pinned themselves into a corner. They couldn’t draft a replacement at 15, so they know they needed to replace Zach in FA. I personally feel they also knew damn well this roster is not even close to championship level. I think they knew there was no way a healthy Carr would succeed with this roster, Carr would have struggled and the entire regime gets fired this year. Enter Rodgers, who already said he was looking to play at least 2 seasons. They could hide behind the idea that struggles with Rodgers as a starter were to be expected as he gets acclimated, and truthfully a healthy Rodgers could get us to 8/9 wins. Plus Rodgers would not want changes in his twilight years, so they knew signing him ensured their employment for 2 more years. And the worst case scenario for Rodgers and the Jets would actually result in a best case scenario for JD and Saleh, buying them both a 3rd extra year beyond their value. It was a calculated move with their own job security at the forefront of their reasoning, so they convinced Woody this is a “championship roster” and forced him to have 100m+ reasons to have to hold onto both of them. Mark my words, Joe Douglas and Robert Saleh will go down as the most destructive GM/HC combo we’ve ever employed
I don’t think it’s a long list really, but James Farrior was meh with us and turned into a star in Pitt, and DeMario Davis was pretty good with us and turned into a pro bowler in New Orleans. Can’t think of any offensive players off hand, though…
Considering the fact that none of us will ever know, all we can do is give our interpretation. To me there was no indication whatsoever of this team going and trading multiple draft picks or getting away from youth before last offseason, and they blew up the whole thing for a big name quarterback – which has has been done to different degrees before with this ownership team. It's rather obvious to me. In my opinion, what happened was was all of the talking heads, all of the fans, everyone was telling the Jets they just needed a quarterback. Douglas and Saleh convinced Woody of that fact, and then Woody went and did what he always does, which is go for headlines and bottom line over football sense. I agree completely that they needed a replacement at the qb position, a veteran, no more rookies for a team that was built out and ready to move forward to be saddled with. We were probably further along than we appear to be now because we had to change everything in the off-season to fit in Rodgers, his salary, the players he wanted, and gear up for a two year run of going for everything. Once they decided that they were going that route, there's no more further considerations. You go all in. What I don't agree with is that they convinced Woody Johnson that Aaron Rodgers was the way to go. I'd bet he was forced on them. This team, I think we all agree, wasn't as close as they and others wanted us to believe. But we were a lot closer than we appear to be now. Without signing the Golden Boys, without trading our 2nd round pick - we're in a much better place. Theoretically. And it's theoretical because it would still come down to signing the right FAs and drafting the right guys and we don't have a lot of evidence that we would've done that. But the direction we decided to take was everything - and I have zero doubt that the direction was dictated by ownership. There were ways to get a better QBt Zach Wilson was last year without trading away a lot of the future. "Ok, I see what you guys mean, then in that case go get Aaron Rodgers" "Sir, we should explore every option before....." "Sorry gents, I've already booked our flight to see him, be at the airport on time please" Obviously I'm exaggerating for effect, but I'd bet a fair amount of money on it being pretty close.
