Twins, Yankees discussing Santana trade

http://boston.redsox.mlb.com/news/a...t_id=2313894&vkey=news_bos&fext=.jsp&c_id=bos

BOSTON -- The Red Sox just won the World Series and they already have one of the top aces in the game in right-hander Josh Beckett. However, it appears that isn't stopping Boston general manager Theo Epstein from making a strong push for two-time American League Cy Young Award winner Johan Santana, who is being dangled in trade talks by the Minnesota Twins.
ESPN.com reported on Thursday that the Red Sox and Twins have discussed a potential deal in which center fielder Coco Crisp, left-hander Jon Lester and promising Minor League shortstop Jed Lowrie would head to Minnesota along with one other prospect in exchange for Santana.

The St. Paul Pioneer Press -- citing a "little birdie" -- had a similar report. In fact, that report stated that the Red Sox have become the favorites while adding that right-handed pitching prospect Justin Masterson would also be going to Minnesota.

Epstein has made a consistent habit of never commenting on trade rumors.

Recently, Epstein predicted it could be a quiet winter for his team. But he also added that things could always change.

"At the same time, we do want to be aggressive in looking for any opportunity to make the club better," Epstein said. "We know our 29 competitors are doing the same. We're never afraid of change. I think change in baseball is often necessary and oftentimes a good thing. But we're also not going to go out and seek change just for the sake of change."

If the Red Sox were to add Santana, they could send a jolt throughout Major League Baseball.

A Beckett-Santana 1-2 punch -- backed by Daisuke Matsuzaka, Curt Schilling and Tim Wakefield -- could be a dominant rotation.

Even if the Red Sox and Twins can agree to the framework of a trade, it would by no means make Santana Boston-bound. Santana has a no-trade clause and will likely seek a contract extension before waiving the clause. If the Red Sox and Twins did agree in principle to a trade, Boston would have 72 hours to negotiate an extension with Santana. That was the formula the Sox used to land Schilling in a Thanksgiving trade with the Diamondbacks following the 2003 season.

Several reports have suggested that Santana could be seeking a contract worth roughly $150 million over six years.

Adding more intrigue to the story is the fact that the Yankees -- the Red Sox's chief rivals -- are also in hot pursuit of Santana. The Angels are another team to have expressed interest.

The Yankees might give the Twins a choice of either Phil Hughes or Ian Kennedy -- two of their best pitching prospects -- as well as outfielder Melky Cabrera and another prospect.

After losing Torii Hunter as a free agent, the Twins desperately need a center fielder. The Red Sox aren't willing to part with Jacoby Ellsbury, their top position prospect. But they would deal Crisp, who has speed and a terrific glove.


Aside from Ellsbury, the other prospect the Red Sox appear steadfast in not giving up is Clay Buchholz, the author of a Sept. 1 no-hitter against the Orioles. Lester, who won the clinching Game 4 of the World Series for the Red Sox, might be a suitable alternative for the Twins.

Lester will be 24 at the start of the 2008 season. The lefty is used to being in trade rumors. In fact, four winters ago, he was supposedly going to the White Sox along with Nomar Garciaparra in a trade that was going to bring Magglio Ordonez to Boston. But that trade fell through, teaching Lester a lesson.

"That kind of got me used to it and made me realize that until Theo calls, it's just all hearsay -- it's all talk, it's something that's not final," Lester said on Wednesday. "Until that day comes, we'll approach it then."

Lester also viewed it as a compliment to be rumored as a key piece for an established pitcher.

"Dan Haren and Johan Santana, that's not bad," said Lester. "Those are two great pitchers to be associated with in a trade. Like I said, I want to be a Red Sox. I want to be here and pitch here for a long time and win more World Series."



Masterson and Lowrie don't yet have the recognition of Buchholz and Ellsbury, but they are two prospects the Red Sox are high on.

The 6-foot-6 Masterson split the 2007 season between Class A Lancaster and Double-A Portland, going 12-8 with a 4.33 ERA. Lowrie hit .300 with five homers and 21 RBIs at Triple-A Pawtucket in the 40 games after his promotion in '07. He spent the rest of his season at Double-A, hitting .297 with eight homers and 49 RBIs.

Boston seemingly became a more appealing trading partner with Minnesota on the heels of the deal the Twins made with the Rays on Wednesday to land outfielder Delmon Young. In that trade, Minnesota parted with starting shortstop Jason Bartlett and starting pitcher Matt Garza, which made Lowrie and Boston's young pitchers more enticing to the Twins.

Schilling was asked earlier this week for his reaction to the Red Sox being mentioned in the Santana sweepstakes.

"Cool," said Schilling. "The thought of Beckett-Santana coming out to match up with somebody is exciting. I know that the Hot Stove is where that stuff happens. I know that if he's on the market like people say he is, I'm sure Theo has talked to [the Twins]. He's going to measure the price tag. We're not in a win-it-now mode. That's our mode every year. We're not operating out of our element when Theo gets in discussions like that. He's not going to sacrifice the future."

The 28-year-old Santana beat out Schilling for the AL Cy Young Award in 2004 and took home the trophy again in '06.

Santana has a career record of 93-44 with an ERA of 3.22, and he went 15-13 in 2007 with a 3.33 ERA. In 219 innings, Santana posted 235 strikeouts, while holding opponents to a .219 batting average.

Ian Browne is a reporter for MLB.com. This story was not subject to the approval of Major League Baseball or its clubs.

 

if the sox get santana im not bothering to watch baseball this year

 

The radio stations around here are saying it is a done deal, that it all rests on being able to rework Santana's contract, for whatever that's worth.

As for me, I am taking a wait and see approach. I expect the Yankees to try and do just about anything to prevent him going to the Sox, so we'll see.

 

yeah I agree....I have my doubts about it being all but done because I would have to assume the yankees make a last ditch effort to pry him outta beantown......if the sox get him then we now officially have two evil empires in baseball haha....this two team league is getting boring though

 

Actually, I would like to get Bedard, maybe more than Santana.

Imagine Santana with the Sox, and Bedard with the Yankees? For argument's sake, let's say our young guys are everything they are cracked up to be.

It would literally be a two team league. Fun for the Northeast, but miserable for everywhere else.

Just imagine somehow the Yankees pulling off Santana and Bedard, while keeping Hughes, Chamberlain, and Wang. hmy:

 

hmy:

Id like for the Yanks to keep Hughes and somehow prevent Santana from going to Boston, however it looks like if they're gonna get him they're going to have to trade Hughes.:sad:

If Boston were to get him, I would go for Haren and/or Bedard instead

 

as reported by WEEI radio in Boston at 10am this morning (I have no idea what station that is) but:

Fox Sports Net (and ESPN confirmed) that the Sox and Twins had agreed in principle to a trade of Santana for a core of Lester, Coco, Lowrie and the 4th either Bowden or Masterson (TBD). They said that contract talks had not yet started with Santana's agent, but were expected soon.

 

old news..........not buying it

 

and what are you basing this on. at least provide some info to support your opinion. everyone here has said that lester is better than kennedy but no one has given a good reason why. (devils reason was that he pitched in the world series and can throw in the mid 90's)

now that i think about it, your statement is uninformed because at the very least they are very similarly rated prospects. however lester has not put up the stats and ian kennedy has. how are they not even close? have you seen ian kennedy pitch?

 

I wouldn't call it total nonsense. I think it is legit. As for Coco's salary, I don;t buy that, cause the Sox can pick up a portion of his salary...and he only makes about 5.5 a year, I think, so it's not as much as they make it out to be.

Plus, that New York Times article was published today..which means it was written yesterday.....kind of Old News when it comes to Hot Stove topics.

As for Buchholz, Lester is proven already, and the other 2 prospects are considered grad A prospects.....especially Masterson....so I can see it.

 

Lester has pithed to an almost 5 era in his short career........heres another question I have. HOw much does Beckett make?( too lazy to look it up)..if boston gets santana and then signs him to the insane ontract that he wants...how pissed is beckett gonna be? Im sure he'll want to renegotiate on the spot

 

several articles have mentioned that the red sox will have to renegotiate witgh beckett if they sign santana.

 

thanks sixfeet...I havent actually seen that but its good to know at least it would cost the sox more if this happens......that makes johan that much more expensive for them

 

First off, Kennedy has only made 3 starts at the MLB level, coming against two barely MLB level teams (KC, TB) and one average team (Tor) and his peripherals weren't that good. His K/BB was only 1.66, and his BABIP was only .231, well below normal and it indicates that he was fairly "lucky" in the Majors. He doesn't have a single pitch that grades out above average. If his command doesn't improve over the 1.66 K/BB, he's going to get absolutely hammered when his BABIP returns to normal levels.

Lester has more experience and better stuff. That combined with him being left handed puts him ahead for me. He hasn't been "far worse" in Boston. He's pitched parts of two seasons, his rookie year last year when he had cancer, and this year when he was coming back from cancer treatment. As the year went on, his strength returned and his stuff got sharper. I expect a very good year out of him next year, wherever he is.

Lowrie was coming off a bad year (though his 2006 numbers were pretty close to Tabata's numbers in any year), but I guarantee he will be on the list next year. He has blown Tabata away in terms of SLG, and had as many home runs this year as Tabata has in his career. All at much higher levels. And from a positional standpoint, Lowrie relative to shortstops is better than Tabata compared to outfielders. I don't see Tabata panning out honestly, which is partly why I have Lowrie ahead of him. He strikes out too much and walks too little. He's Wily Mo Pena with more speed and a little less power IMO.

The most important thing in this instance though isn't who will be better at the end of their careers. Right now, the Twins don't need an outfielder who won't be ready for at least 4 years. They DO however need a shoerstop who's ready now. So for this specific trade at the very least, there's no denying that Lowire has MUCH more value.

As usual, WRONG! There are many reports that even if the Sox didn't go after Santana, the Twins were interested in Crisp in a different deal. They do have interest in him.

Complete nonsense. First of all, Beckett is under contract for a while. They don't HAVE to renegotiate anything. Secondly, he's already taken less than market value to sign and he knows it. His agent told him not to sign the extension last year, but he did anyway. Third, I'm sure he's not going to mind an almost guaranteed title shot for as long as they're both in Boston. Fourth, teams don't renegotiate with players based on other guys they sign. If they did, JD Drew wouldn't be making more than Ortiz, and Eric Gagne wouldn't have gotten more than Papelbon. That's just not how the system works.