No. Revis was. Cro makes plays at times. But he is beatable and often gets turned around and gives up big plays. But he can definitely make this team. No way though he is getting $8 mil next year.
So in other words, of all the QBs playing against teams that had already packed it in, Geno was the best. lol
Smith sucks when the season counts. He did the same thing at the end of 13. Did that carry over into last season? Not until last season didn't matter. Next!
Really superficial argument. Smith sucked in 2013 because, in no small part, his receivers sucked. None of the starters at the WR position are starters on any other team. Kerley is the only starter period and he's a shrimp with very limited speed. So, really, you can somewhat discount Smith entire ROOKIE season based on being a rookie and have virtually no credible targets. You know, if you're trying to make a reasoned judgment. Smith's second year? He improved. Still, he didn't turn a corner, but he did improve. He sucked, true. But, really, (and I'd like you to honestly answer) who among the Jets DIDN'T suck? Who on the Jets offense (or defense for that matter) distinguished himself with better than expected play? N-O-B-O-D-Y!! So, if you're fairly assessing seasons, tell me who SHOULD BE lauded beyond Richardson, who, for all the props he's given, didn't have a ton of game-changing plays either. the Smith Haters do this: they raise the bar for performance solely for him. Everyone else gets a free pass. (hahaha, free pass, get it?) They'll laud Jace Amaro and forget it was Smith who got him the ball. They'll disparage Smith, yet completely ignore the turnstile and critical penalties from the OG spots. Smith isn't Joe Namath, but he's statistically the 8TH BEST QB IN NEW YORK JETS HISTORY!!
You're right and I don't want to blow off another season due to an incompetent Qb which seems to be the way things go around here. But he's on the team and a lot of Qbs are terrible their first two seasons. It's a learning process. Just don't learn on the job and lose games. If he comes into camp and plays well he'll have a short leash. It's expected that he after 29 starts knows how to play the game smarter. To me Fitz is the starter now not Geno. Geno would have to win the job legitimately and keep the job. You can throw all of this out (and Geno too) if we draft Mariota.
So, seriously, you believe the Jets lost mostly because of Geno Smith? Again, the most superficial of judgments. If it were solely or even mostly because of Smith, the Jets wouldn't have a new GM, new HC, and new scouting department. They wouldn't have chosen 4 new OL. They wouldn't have traded for a WR, wouldn't have remade their entire secondary. Again, Smith, not a world beater...yet. But clearly not the major reason the Jets lost. The Jets defense? Gave up the most 3rd and longs in the league! Were in the running for having a record few number of turnovers. Gave up TD passes like they didn't actually field a secondary. As bad as Smith was, he was no worse than the OL and secondary. I'd claim he was better, actually.
Every year all teams sign new O-linemen. And bring them into camp. It was not the reason that Geno sucks. And one of the key reasons Idzik was lambasted and fired was because the Qb he selected was given the starting job and played poorly. To me this is Geno's make or break year.
I would submit that if an OL is NOT good, it has a direct effect on a QB's performance. I know I'm going out on a limb here (sarcasm). Yeah, imagine, a GM getting lambasted because a rookie QB didn't play like NOT a rookie and there were no better options? But, the notion that 4 OL were brought in because the unit was good seems absurd. sorry. Teams bring in DBs all the time too. Are we to assume that the Jets secondary was also good? It is, and should be, Geno's make or break year. But to suggest that he was the sole or even major reason the Jets went 4-12 last year ignores a whole lot of other suck on the team.
They brought in Giacomini last year for money reasons after they decided not to re-sign Howard. And they signed a few guys so far to be backups. Probably the starters will end up the same guys. Our OL was not the reason we were 4-12. It was a combination of things including bad coaching. But Geno was near the top of the list.
I disagree. I think the OL was a MAJOR reason why the team finished at 4-12 and a major reason why the QB play was not very good. IMO, the OL has been a major reason why Jets QBs (that's right multiple QBs) have been bad. Each Jets QB that plays for currently or played with other teams in the past performed better than they did for the Jets. It's not a coincidence that Jets QBs suck and the OL individuals--like the OGs--are rated poorly. I recognize that you don't believe this. So, I recognize that we will probably disagree on a number of things. I'm sure you're bright in other areas tho.
Listen I'm not a Geno hater. But the facts are: he stinks! But he does have talent to play Qb in the NFL and he's still a young Qb but he's not inexperienced: 29 starts is a lot. At this point you would expect improvement. To me the OL was ok last year. I did not see the kind of breakdowns in protection that would affect a Qbs effectiveness. Mangold still made the Pro Bowl. Brick is on the way down but still average. Breno is ok. Based on what we saw of Aboushi he held his own and played ok. I don't judge Geno on that first Buff game but it was as bad as it can get. And saw improvement the last five games. I think that was considerable although some fans say it was an illusion. To me he played decently down the stretch. Look if he can't beat out Fitz then to me he's going to be a career backup. He has to be smarter on and off of the field. I'm not giving up on him yet but I'm against him starting unless he actually wins the job.
Yet you've really not presented a single fact that supports your contention. I love it, people here use their own perceived status as "experts" to make claims about players. Never once presenting anything resembling evidence or a critical, detailed, nuanced treatment of a topic. It's all about how great their opinion is, which, last time I checked, had nobody but them supporting it. You're nobody. So, why should I take your word for it when you clearly you've ignored all the other Jets crappy play around him? I mean, you've got the absurd opinion that an OL that has not supported THREE QBs well over the last years is somehow irrelevant to how well a QB can possibly play? You've ignored the fact that in Geno's first year his main receivers were David Nelson and Jeremy Kerley, neither of whom can out run ME, much less an NFL DB. You've ignored that Brian Winters was THE WORST OG in the NFL and before him some guy named Vlad Ducasse was manning that spot and that some has been named Bartolo Colon (it might as well be) is the other OG, two spots that, if not playing well, provide a defense with the fastest gateway to pressuring a QB. Your arguments are farcical and show an immaturity that you should really look to address.
Thanks for the put downs but the facts are that Geno had better receivers in 2014, the OL was not terrible etc. Sure it was a 4-12 team and he was one of the reasons for that. Almost everyone thinks the Jets need an upgrade at QB. I doubt I'll reply to anymore of your idiotic rants.
Sorry for the putdown, it was called for, but it doesn't help a discussion. I apologize. but the OL WAS terrible at the OG spots, both years. That's a documented fact. It's one you won't admit, and one you won't at all consider as a major obstacle to a productive passing offense, but the data is there. Yes, the receivers were better in Smith's second season, but they'd have to be better than the absolute worst receivers in the NFL and possibly NCAA BCS. They were absolutely terrible in Smith's first year. Moreover, if you were a critical thinker, you'd also admit that the single major upgrade they made to the WR corps, Decker, was injured and not 100% for the majority of last season as well. So, really, we're not talking about a major upgrade in talent or continuity between the two seasons. You know, again, just repeating that someone "sucks" without really looking beyond the veneer of it or acknowledging other factors that contributed is not a critical treatment of an issue or player. It's really just an ad hominem attack.
The putdowns not called for just because someone disagrees with you. Again I'm not against Geno and don't think you can make a final decision on him yet. But he has 29 starts albeit with a bad team. If we had a better Qb last season the record would have been better. I personally feel we had better talent than 4-12. Geno's stats are among the worst in the league. I think second worst for starting Qbs. He did not bring the team up he brought them down. I disagree with you about the Jets OL. You say it's a documented fact that the guard position was terrible. So where's the documentation. Just your opinion bro. I don't think they were terrible. Replacement at that position is a norm among all teams in the NFL but for the most part we'll have the same OL starters except maybe Colon. And he's still on the team.
And if we had a better RB...and if we had a better set of OGs. These are speculations masquerading as fact. You state Geno's stats are among the worst. But so are the OGs. So are the WRs, talent wise. I've shared, AT LEAST three times, the ratings of the OGs, the rating of the OL as a whole. Some people disagree with the ratings, but it's not MY rating it's an objective rating. I've mention the names of the receivers: David Nelson, not on anyone's team, Stephen Hill, not anyone's starter, not on the Jets anymore. I've mentioned Decker's injury, which persisted for most of the season. So, I've provided evidence. You've provided "among the worst in the league..." forgive me if I insult you again and state that your opinion lacks heft and seems like so much hating because, sure, his stats sucked. But that's solely on him when TEN other players line up with him? PFF OL Rankings: http://thejetpress.com/2014/01/15/pff-offensive-line-rankings-new-york-jets-ranked-25th/ That's one... Here's another: http://www.advancedfootballanalytics.com/index.php/home/stats/offensive-players/team-offensive-lines
At least I didn't call him Browning Nagle - though some believe he is this generation's version of him.
haha, Some feel that Browning got a raw deal. He got all of a part of a rookie season to prove himself, no? I don't remember...
