whats interesting is that a lot of the great QBs aren't ugly people... i don't know what there is to that but if Rick Lyle was a HOF QB he'd be breaking the mold. He has a defensive end look. no homo???
So because you can't convince me that a great release and a strong arm make him a good quarterback when he's showed essentially nothing in games you have to make it personal. You're a true gentleman. Make a reasonable argument and I'll agree with it. Until then . . .
No one's trying to convince you he's a good quarterback because he has a great release and a strong arm. No one's trying to convince you he's a good quarterback, period.
I have. The point is that we drafted Clemens for a reason - he has a lot of upside and he was a great QB in college - so he has potential and we should find out what we have in him. No one is saying he is a good NFL QB, because there's no way to know. Just like there's no way to know what we really have in Ratliff or Ainge or any QB we could potentially draft. Giving up on Clemens now would be like drafting a QB in the first round and then drafting another QB in the second round because the first guy hasn't proved he can play at the NFL level.
We drafted Clemens because Mangini thought he had a lot of upside. I very much doubt Tannenbaum is a talent evaluator. Mangini gave him his shot and he blew it. He was so bad Mangini kept Chad around to challenge him and beat him out for the starting QB spot. He then traded for Favre after having seen enough of Clemens. We're not talking about a rookie. Clemens has been in the league three years and was a good, not great QB in college (great QBs go in round 1). He's shown nothing in the pros. I agree there's no way the team can know what they have in Ratliff, Ainge, or someone they might draft. But after three years, several regular season starts, and three preseasons I think the Jets have an idea what they have in Clemens. The fact that there's even going to be a competition between Clemens, Ratliff, and Ainge is incredibly telling. Why isn't he just annointed the starter when the other two have never thrown a regular season pass in an NFL game?
How can you doubt Tannenbaum as a talent evaluator? Cause he clearly was wrong to pick Revis, Harris, D'Brick and Mangold. Oh and Keller sucks too.... Clemens wasn't a 1st round pick because he was injured during his senior year and thus his draft status dropped as a result. He certainly would've gone in the 1st if he played out his final year. Also that comment about Mangini keeping Chad just because of he didn't trust Clemens could be the starter...where did you get that info? Clemens did start out poor in TC last year I admit, but as the preseason progressed, he did get better. Plus, Favre was brought here to sell PSLs. Of course Woody knew fans tied Clemens to the painful memories of the 2007 season, so he got Favre because it was looking like he did something about the situation as well as getting a fan favorite. Clemens needs to get another shot.
I don't think Tannenbaum made the picks. I believe Mangini and the rest of the staff had considerably more input. I think they made the calls and Tannenbaum made the deals. While I have no inside information to tell me this is true, Tannenbaum was a cap guy, not a scout. It is more than likely that Ryan is making most of the calls now, and then Tannenbaum does the negotiations. I may be wrong, but this is the I believe it goes down. Of course Mangini kept Chad around because he didn't feel comfortable with Clemens. Yes, the Jets made the trade for Favre because the fans felt badly about Clemens. Forget about what the coaching staff thought, they made it for the fans. :rofl: Clemens was having a good senior year and may have been a first round pick, but not based on his earlier college years. If he were that good a prospect someone would have grabbed him in the first round.
Clemens was never going to be a first round pick. I remember one draft mag I had rated him as a 5th-6th rounder.
You may be right. But Clemens wasn't very good when he played, and the offensive line was atrocious. His play that season means little when looking back on it now, just because he was a young QB in a horrible situation. And I think you're underestimating how highly the Jets think of Brett Ratliff. I think it's telling that they don't want to bring in a veteran because they think someone can do the job, and I really think that guy is Ratliff. But they want to see it for themselves first, and I wouldn't count out Clemens.
I've just watched Super Bowl III again and it's amazing how good Namath looked. The guy had a gun and the quickest release I've ever seen. No one could get the ball to his receivers quicker than Namath. Boy, would it be great if the Jets could get a QB anywhere near that good. I'm really hoping Ratliff is the answer. He looked like he could be something special. Maybe the Jets can finally get lucky with an unknown.
I'm not putting THAT much hope in Ratliff. I did think he could play in the pros when I saw him at Utah, and he looked the part in preseason, that's for sure. On the flip side, you could say Clemens looked the part in the 2007 preseason. That's from 2007. http://fifthdown.blogs.nytimes.com/2007/08/30/position-battles-and-preseason-all-stars/
I gotta disagree there. Most sources I saw had him projected in the 3-4 at the very lowest and that was after his injury. I'm pretty sure Clemens would have been drafted in the late first or earlier second round if he hadn't broken his ankle.
You seem to have a penchant for deciding which arguments are reasonable and which are not based upon your own unvarying opinion.
You don't mention Woody during the whole process of the Favre trade. Woody essentially got Favre because wanted to sell these PSLs to the fans, not because the coaching staff/Tannenbaum demanded he do so. While I do not have direct proof of this, there is indirect proof everywhere. You could tell Favre's play contrasts with how Mangini likes the game to be played at the QB positon, not to mention Mangini (or any coach for that matter) would want to acquire a QB in the middle of training camp. Also the fact that Woody wanted Favre back even though he would turn 40 next year, has a tear in his bicep, and stunk up last 5 games of the season, just goes to show how much of the Favre deal was ticket sales driven.
