Sorry I must not be seeing what you guys are seeing. Pace is not worthy of just keeping around. We go a defense that is revved up to attack and blitz. Exactly how does Pace factor into that equation? He is 5 steps late to every tackle and can't cover me out in the flat. My dream is he test positve again for a control substance then we can be finished with him for good. David Harris had 3 times the amount of tackles Pace had last year...3 TIMES!!!!!!!!
Ha, Calvin Pace had 5 sacks last season. Coples had 6.5 and people were jerking each other off about it
Thats the lesser of 2 evil. Its still evil. If you have two bad parts why keep both then. Get rid of them and move on.
I can't speak to how he will do in the new defense but he did a good job of playing his role in Rex's defense. He set the edge consistently and created pressure at times. He was good, not great, against the run and pass. I think a lot of fans severely under value the ability of a 3-4 OLB to set the edge consistently. Without that your D is regularly getting gouged for big gains outside. He's not a coverage LB but most 3-4 OLB's aren't, especially in Rex Ryans defense. It would be great to have that beast edge rusher out there but we don't until we do.
Pace had 40 tackles last year by contrast Harris had 123 tackles. Our entire defense couldn't stop anyone last year. He is as old as dirt anyone can fill his position. You can stumble and get 40 tackles. Time to move on he hasn't been a impact player since his first year with Eric Mangini.
a lot of times his job was not to make the tackle but to force the ball carrier to the middle of the defense. I'm not saying he's an impact player. If someone earns his spot they should take it. if they can't beat out pace they don't belong on the field. if they do then fine cut him.
while its true that his d-line (and scheme) helped him get the 15.5 sacks he's acquired in the last 2 years, HE still got those sacks and they're still signs of an effective player. his accolades are earned, and given how he's been more able to help set the edge and is a pros pro in terms of preparation, clearly theres a reason he's persisted with us for so long. He's no young physical threat, but he can still play, he knows what the hell he's doing, he can teach others how to go about playing in this league in all facets, and thus he can play mentor AND stopgap SOLB. no reason to cut him till we've assured ourselves that we have two effective strong side players in place. Harris SHOULD have more tackles, most 3-4 ILB's wind up with the most on the team.
It's laughable that you're judging a player by tackles especially when comparing him to the number one tackling position on every team. Elvis Dumervil had 37 tackles, Cameron Wake had 36. Cut them!!! As NSM said he's not an all world player but he's good at what he does and funnels the play back inside. Watch a bad 3-4 defense and you'll appreciate what Pace does in that he keeps contain and makes sure that the interior linebackers make the play in between the tackles rather than letting ball carriers get outside for big gains. I long for the day when people watch a football game and understand it further than a silly stat like tackles. Not to mention he's a year removed from double digit sacks. The guy will be a very good player to have both in the locker room and on first and second down for the veteran minimum. I hate to use the phrase but this is really an SMH comment and thread in general.
pace sets the edge for this defense and he does it incredibly well...it's not all about the big stats.
Trevor Reilly could set the edge and what is Coples role on this team? Coples at least can rush the passer. We should start getting younger at OLB. If Bowles defense calls for 80% blitzes then Pace doesn't factor in at all.
Ok stay focus here. Neither Dumervil or Wake are on this team. But since you went there I'll humor you. Both the above players are elite unlike old fart Pace. Comparing Pace to them is comical. So stats like tackles is silly...oh boy your special. Guess what an agent uses when he negotiates for his client? You should watch more football because if you did you would have notice the Jets were gashed on defense because neither Pace nor Babin could get a sniff of the QB. Rogers, Brady, even Kyle Orton looked like Unitas against the Jets defense.
Which of Reilly's 0 sacks (over the course of 14 games) and 15 tackles (also over 14 games with no more than 3 in any one game, which means five games he played in without making a tackle) makes you believe that he can be half the player that Pace or Babin is? What do you see in your crystal ball that the rest of us are missing?
I like reilly, perhaps he can fill the role, we'll find out in camp. thats really the point, we need to actually see youth develop before we move on from Pace. we want to get younger, but throwing out a known quantity on a smallish deal (who could probably stand to help our youth) before anything materializes is a bad idea. Mauldin is unknown at this time, Reilly has barely taken any real defensive snaps, why handicap ourselves by solely relying on inexperienced entities when we can keep everybody and see how things play out? its unnecessary opportunity cost. the point is that 3-4 ILB's tend to get more tackles than their OLB compatriots in general, so comparing stats in that way is apples and oranges. even top tier 3-4 OLB's get less tackles than ILB's. its not a good metric of quality. its like blaming a QB for having less running yards than RB's, of course they would they get less opportunity to do so. and Pace was the least of our problems when playing those guys...
So our celebration was postponed... "Mission Accomplished" He has to be a backup. No way we are going into this with him on the field +60% of the time..
Additionally, he's keeping other players from developing. He should've been gone three years ago. At this point in his career, he should be a journeyman. But I guess we kept him on the roster because we didn't want to break up the 8-8, 6-10, 8-8, 4-12 dynasty.
His PT will drop this year compared to the past. The nickel and dime packages will be used much more frequently, and with the talent on the line it's LB that will suffer loss of snaps.
Very true but I don't want him to get 60% of the playing time when the OLB is used... I seriously want him to be used almost never..
You use the stat books to judge players and I'm the one that needs to watch more football? The point for bringing up these players was how tackles don't really tell the story with players who aren't supposed to be making an abundant amount of tackles. If you get 80-90 tackles from your 3-4 strong side backer you either have one of the best players in the league or a horrible defense. Pace plays on the strong side of the formation on the outside shade of the tightend. His job is to make sure that no one including the runner or the tightend and tackle, get outside of him. If any of them get outside of Pace then they get up to the second level and seal the inside linebacker allowing for a free run up to the secondary and that's where you get into a whole host of problems. The tackle/tightend will often combination block as pictured below. Pace along with the the other the other defensive lineman need to make sure that this doesn't happen.
Calvin Pace reminds me of an old rug that you know in your heart that you should of gotten rid of along time ago but for some reason you keep getting it cleaned and keeping it there Against your better judgement even though you know its a peice of shit
