Elgin Baylor must own the NBA record for most times representing his team (Clippers) on the draft lottery dais. Anyone else would have been long gone.
Not to mention, why get rid of your security policy at backup QB? Especially when you already have a team full of guys that know and have experience in a different offense especially tailored to his strengths.
I obviously don't know for sure, since I'm not Elway, but if you want my two cents, I would say he didn't believe in him from the start and never did. He may have gotten a little caught up in the hype at different points. But I think deep down, he was never really a fan and didn't think that teams can win without having a prolific passing attack. Words are one thing, actions are another, and as soon as Elway got his chance to get out of Tebowmania without being crucified by the fan base, he took it and ran with it. Just my opinion, of course, but I think it was simply that Elway did not believe the Broncos could possibly win a championship with Tebow.
If your point is that Tim Tebow is unlikely to compel us to bench Mark Sanchez for his majestic honeur....mission accomplished. ? . ? What does any of this have to do with a highly paid guy that only cost a 4th round pick being unable to run a gimmick formation that his skills are tailored for in a limited role? Elway was canning his quarterback, not his wildcat gimmick. We bought a wildcat gimmick, not a serious starting quarterback. Who is hurt here I'm confused?
This is what a lot of people are missing. We added a pretty potent weapon for Rex Ryan to deploy without giving up anything but an exchange of draft picks, and the guy doesn't break the bank. I don't see a downside except for the hype, etc, but the Jets always have something going on in that regard so I don't see that as a big deal.
Lack of rhythm in the O, division in the fanbase, home games not only with fans booing Sanchez but rooting for his replacement with Tebow, division in the locker room along the same lines. A more complicated offense, yes, even than Schotty's, using plays that are for Sanchez as well as ones for Tebow, and the O having to learn them and practice them. I see plenty of downside, but most of all that the focus will be somewhat other than helping Mark Sanchez better learn how to read D's.
my point is that someone's playing ability doesn't translate to an ability to evaluate talent, so I am not going to defer my opinion to his simply on that criteria. is there more projection when drafting a player than dealing with an established player? of course. but at the end of the day it is still evaluating. Elway clearly wants a great passer. that isn't Tebow and likely never will be Tebow. that being said, his preference for someone who can make plays solely on his ability to read defenses and make throws doesn't mean Tebow doesn't have skills and abilities that can help a team win, so I certainly am not going to dismiss Tebow because he isn't Elway's ideal QB, because that is all Elway getting rid of Tebow reflects -- that Tebow isn't Elway's ideal QB. it doesn't mean he isn't capable of succeeding as a QB in the NFL in a different manner than Elway wants a QB to play.
Exactly. Hope I don't get shot for this, but it's like when Bill Walsh stepped up and wanted Steve Young from Tampa, even when many in his organization completely disagreed with it. Not saying that Tebow will turn out like Young, but it does highlight the fact that even "football" people can have different opinions as to someone's potential.
it's hard to take elway's opinion of tebow seriously because it was clear from the very beginning that elway did not like the idea of tim tebow has the starting qb for the broncos. elway didn't watch him for 2 years and then make a decision. it was clearly from a guilty until proven innocent point of view. he didn't even bother with the pr friendly, gm bullshit talk. he would kind of just take digs at tebow all the way through. also, taking a chance on manning isn't a big risk. nfl teams have seen him. i'm sure he got checked out physically. so if you're told this is a healthy manning, then there really isn't much more of a sure thing. you might think it's a big risk in your mind and then apply it to elway's decision.. but for 90 million, i'm willing to bet that you think the risk of signing peyton manning is far greater than what elway thinks it is. the bolded doesn't really make sense. why would it be a smart move to take a chance on a qb when you're sure you're getting the real deal in manning? the jets had to think the same way. maybe sanchez develops into a great starting qb, but you already know what you're going to get with manning. again, easy choice. you go with the hall of famer over a reasonable prospect. the titans just drafted jake locker last year. pretty good prospect, showed some skills in limited playtime. still interested in manning. not because they don't believe in locker, but because this is peyton manning. as for what he got in return for tebow.. denver doesn't dictate the cost once you make it known you're set on getting rid of him. the market does. the fact that teams were only willing to give up a 4th and a 6th is more of an indication of what the rest of the nfl thinks tebow's value is. if jacksonville got him for a 2nd, it's not like elway thought higher of tebow. i really think elway wanted to get rid of tebow. he was just clearly not a fan of him as a player, which can only lead to not liking the media circus that he brings. also, unlike the jets, the broncos weren't going to put tebow in for certain packages. backup qbs aren't really supposed to be security policies. they're just there. if your starting qb goes down, you don't look to the 2 and go, whew at least we have this guy as a security policy. so why deal with the tebow circus for any longer than you really have to?
You make it sound like Elway just has some kind of prejudice about having a certain kind of Qb. I think he prefers to have a Qb who he thinks will be successful in the NFL, and that Tebow is not that kind of Qb. It's not a question of some disembodied ideal, but rather of what works, what is necessary, in the NFL. Plus Elway is not merely a former player. He's been the GM of hte Broncos for two years now. "still evaluating" I call BS. Assessing someone as a draft pick involves a whole lot less information than having a player on your team for two years. Just give that one up, and we will call it a day. You can have your opinion that Tanny, not a football guy, Woody, who knows even less, and Ryan, a defensive guy, know how to assess Qb's better than John Elway, but I like my argument better.
Please. Elway may well have started out with skepticism of Tebow, but he didn't see enough for two years to change his mind on Tebow. Let's put it this way - if the Broncos had beaten the Pats, even made it to the SB, with solid performances by Tebow, do you still think Elway would have gotten Manning? I think not, but we don't have to worry about it, since Tebow confirmed Elway's take on him.
Why bother having a backup QB then? They should just use that roster spot for another position and throw in a punter or a lineman or something if the starter goes down.
If we had a viable option at backup QB last year after Sanchez the year might have finished very differently. Instead of Mark taking a beating playing hurt because there is no other option maybe he takes a week off and recovers. Not blaming injury for all his shortcomings last season but it was obvious he wasn't playing at 100% when everytime he takes a hit he runs bent over to the sidelines holding his throwing shoulder.
Hmm, let's see, here's John Elway prior to the start of the 2011 season, before John Fox was even hired. Of course Elway "has some kind of prejudice about having a certain kind of Qb" as his very own words indicate that fact.
I put this up in another thread but Ill bring it over here to. Just a side thought, but while I was watching the analysts today talk about the locker room chemistry BS blah blah blah, it occurred to me that Tebow can have a positive effect on the locker room. At least on Santonio Holmes and Mark Sanchez. Holmes who was probably more at fault with that crap from last year will now be forced into being best friends with Sanchez. He wants the ball so much, well then he better get HIS ass in gear and get on the same page with Mark. If they can get in sync well then that means more touches, and the playcalling will lean towards their part of the offense.
We've had that already, even in good years, before Tebow got here. None of that gains or loses you a yard, so what? Sanchez is either going to improve on his own or he's not. He's played three years now, been to the playoffs, there's no more need for mentors, etc. He's the starting QB, he'll get the focus from the coaches, if anything Sparano's offense figures to be simpler than the previous one. Anything could backfire in theory, but we've not given up much here and we've added a big piece in Tebow. It's not like our offense was humming along up to now, not like we had a great locker room and happy fan base, so I don't see any of this as a problem. It already had to be fixed.
why use the sensational term "prejudice" when "preference" is just as good? my position has nothing to do with siding with Tanny or Rex or Woody, it has to do with your reasoning for siding with Elway is flawed because being the GM in no way means he can evaluate talent, it means he convinced someone he was able to do the job. considering how many GM's in the history of the NFL have been bad, your position that his being the GM means he has the ability to evaluate talent is as flawed as saying that because he was a good player he has the ability to evaluate talent. both have empirical evidence disputing them. pointing that out certainly doesn't equate to siding with the Jets on this trade. how many great QB's have been traded in their careers prior to developing? so, again, someone not seeing a player's talent in no way equates to that player not having it.
