That window might have closed already. In 2008 our offensive line and fullback were as follows: Ferguson,Faneca,Mangold,Moore and Woody with T-Rich as fullback. All of those guys except Moore have been to the pro-bowl. If Pennington weren't made of glass, or Favre had stayed another year then that would have been our year. We had a damn good run game, a good defense and plenty of role players. 2009 was similar even with the loss of Faneca (who was on the decline). Last night on the offensive line we had: Ferguson, Slauson, Baxter, Moore, Hunter with John Conner as fullback. What do we expect? Was last night really on Sanchez? Is it Shonn Greene's fault? I think it's more on the front office. We whiffed on the Vladimir Ducasse pick so far, and we haven't replaced the good offensive linemen we lost. Tanny has done a great job bringing in talent, but we are just way too thin at o-line. Maybe they thought Woody was coming back, and of course if we had Mangold and Woody in there things wouldn't be as bad.
I somewhat agree with what your saying. We need to start stockpiling draft picks because our lack of depth is horrifying right now. The Ducasse pick looks worse and worse every day and the lack of any real attempt at building any OL depth is really showing. He obviously missed on Gholston but the jury is still out on Wilson who has shown major improvement this season. I also think that Wilkerson is looking like he is going to turn into a pretty good player. I don't even think that what we gave up in trades to get vets is bad. We got Cromartie for a high pick but Holmes for a 5th was a steal. It's the lack of trading down and getting more picks on draft day.
Just for fun, here is Tanny's draft history. He started as GM in Feb 2006. I didn't bother with 2010 or 2011, since it's too early to tell about those guys imo. 2009 5 Mark Sanchez QB USC 3 65 Shonn Greene RB Iowa 6 193 Matt Slauson G Nebraska 2008 - New York Jets RD SEL # PLAYER POSITION SCHOOL 1 6 Vernon Gholston LB Ohio State 1 30 Dustin Keller TE Purdue 4 113 Dwight Lowery CB San Jose State 5 162 Erik Ainge QB Tennessee 6 171 Marcus Henry WR Kansas 7 211 Nate Garner T Arkansas 2007 - New York Jets RD SEL # PLAYER POSITION SCHOOL 1 14 Darrelle Revis CB Pittsburgh 2 47 David Harris ILB Michigan 6 177 Jacob Bender T Nicholls State 7 235 Chansi Stuckey WR Clemson 2006 - New York Jets RD SEL # PLAYER POSITION SCHOOL 1 4 D'Brickashaw T Virginia 1 29 Nick Mangold C Ohio State 2 49 Kellen Clemens QB Oregon 3 76 Anthony Schlegel LB Ohio State 3 97 Eric Smith DB Michigan State 4 103 Brad Smith WR Missouri 4 117 Leon Washington RB Florida State 5 150 Jason Pociask TE Wisconsin 6 189 Drew Coleman CB Texas Christian 7 220 Titus Adams DT Nebraska
Bradway was a giant fuckup from the start. Herm was the reason why talented teams didn't go further. Kneel the ball and back the kicker up at Heinz field. Good move moron. The head that will roll is schotty. Everyone else will be safe due to their contract extensions.
I think it's a mistake to focus solely on draft results when considering Tanny's tenure. His biggest fault this year imo may well have been impacted by the Failure that is Ducasse, but more immediately he should have done more to shore up the OL depth. Imo it's really inexcusable that he did not.
I think even with Woody back we'd be in trouble right now. He was old and injury-prone and just waiting to be a dropout on the line. Slauson is not a good left guard although not as bad as what the Jets have had there on occasion in the past. The way I rate the Jets offensive line right now is: LT - Ferguson is a plus player and gets much better than that when he has a good guard next to him. LG - Slauson is a journeyman and probably not going to be a lot better than that. He's replacement level meaning the Jets should be looking to replace him with better and the odds are pretty good they could find somebody above his talent level if they prioritized it. C - Mangold is the best center in the NFL and unfortunately his minor tendency to nagging injuries that he can play with turned into one that he couldn't play through. His back is a major concern and the Jets should not expect that he will be playing for them for more than another few seasons. If he does manage to play another 5 or 6 years he will be a lock-cinch first ballot hall of famer but the odds are that he will decline and drop out before that as he hits late 20's and the back begins to rebel on him. If you've had a back problem you know what I mean about them blowing up as you approach 30. RG - Brandon Moore is a solid guard and much like Ferguson he becomes better with a good tackle next to him. If the Jets line solidifies Moore will be a factor for another few years. If it does not he won't. He's a drive blocker and he's much at the best of his game when the line is trying to push the other team backwards the whole game. RT - Wayne Hunter is a 30 year old backup who the Jets handed the job too when it become clear that Woody was out of the picture. All indications at this point are that he's not good enough to start in the NFL and that he's a major weak link in the Jets offensive front. You can't have weak links anywhere on the line but for the Jets having one at RT in between an aging power guard and a primarily pass-catching tight-end is a critical gaffe.
Yeah, tough year. Gholston was obviously a bust. It's hard to tell if Keller was worth a first round pick, but the knee jerk reaction is no..and can we stop drafting TE's in the first round?
Agreed. His track record with the OL has been marginal at best when it comes to replacing lost players. Brick and Mangold were home runs, but the LG position has been an issue since Kendall left in 07. RT has gone straight to hell, and Brand Moore deserves his name in the ring of honor for being so constant over nearly a decade, but even now he needs replacing. The draft will be a OL and LB draft, or else they'll have to replace the franchise QB because he'll be David Carr 2.0 I can't believe they had a 1st round grade on Ducasse. They have to stop listening to the coach who bangs the table for his "I can make him a player" prospect. Gholston, now Ducasse. I am giving him one more year to show he can play at this level, the same way I did with Gholston. And I see why they liked ducasse - his raw power is something to behold, but football is a game of technique. Also, all of the ground and pound power guys are gone. Everyone who smacked people in the mouth got cut due to age, and the youngin's aren't pulling their weight right now.
Keller is worth the end of the 1st round pick. But anything above 25 and he'd be tough to justify. He's Sanchez's safety blanket. And his blocking has improved. If the Jets had another TE to offset him, he could be even more dangerous. Cumberland's gone for the year, so we won't know.
Good analysis. I agree on Woody, but I can't help but think he'd be better than Hunter even if he were banged up. I think the shortened off season hurt the team a bit. I hope you're wrong about Mangold and his back problems, the offense was a complete clusterfuck without him.
Yeah the double TE thing is in vogue lately. It might have been interesting with Cumberland. It's hard for me to justify Keller's draft position. He was basically drafted as a receiving TE and his best season was last year which was 687 yards and 5 TDs. Of course I watch the guy week in and week out, and he seems a lot more talented than those numbers and probably has been hurt by having a rookie QB for part of his career and a run first offense up until last season. EDIT: Also for how bad 2008 was, it's amazing how good 2006/2007 were in the early rounds.
I hope I'm wrong about Mangold too. He reminds me a lot of Joe Klecko in the way his units play above their talent level when he's around and look kind of weak when he's not.
That would be the reason. Every year he gets better. Which means that he should see a new contract. He may never be a pro bowl player, but he'll be a good one. Like the Shaun Ellis of TEs without 2 pro bowls.
Let's see.... Changing the OC in mid-season is a good idea? Does that mean the offense will change or would they promote from within and maintain the same system of calling plays and the same plays? If they change those things, the players will have to learn it on the fly. What's the preferred scenario? In addition, if the offensive line is the issue on offense, how will changing the OC change that? If they must pass, it is a matter of execution pure and simple. Do we have the weapons? I believe the consensus here that we do. Other opinions? If Sanchez is the issue in that he cannot carry the load, assuming that they cannot run the ball, how does changing the OC change any of that? Who else would get the ball that can do better right now? Finally, I'm not a Schotty fan but I do not see how letting layers mouth off in this way about the coaches is a good thing, its not, this is in fact indicating a major problem, a lack of discipline by JETS players. Who is running this team, the players or the coaches? Think about it.
They've been disciplined for the past 2 years. and no one has come out and said "we got outcoached." That'll get you cut, and the message will be sent. However, if they do change OCs, it'll be from within so the language stays the same.
I think you hit the nail on the head here. Tannenbaum was well aware of the personnel changes coming on the o line, and with a wide open fa market, he did nothing to improve it or give it depth (or for the d line either). Instead he went after yet another corner back and brought in receivers that are at best a slight upgrade from what we had. The team is in a bad place right now because of this. Let's hope the GM or big mouth Rex can come up with a fix quick.
Some might add that Tanny's consistent failure to get a pass rushing LB in there is another, but imo his mishandling of the OL basically since Kendall left has been his worst legacy. So far.
I missed that. Totally agree. Pace is a good complimentary LB to the premier pass rusher, but he is never going to be elite. They have to attack that position this year or the defense will continue to be stagnant on 3rd down. The money down has become an issue.
One of the reasons I am doubtful anything happens mid-season is that the existing staff has no obvious candidate(s) to replace Schotty. I have to laugh at those who seriously proposed it be Callahan. Promoting the guy who is directly in charge of the worst performing unit on the team? Yeah taht makes sense. Let's reward ineptitude. Frankly the notion that some Schotty Haters propose Callahan as a replacement shows better than anything else how irrational they can be.
