On to Dallas...

That is one way to look at it.

 

It’s hard to find apples to apples but the Steelers let Mitch Trubisky ice the game for them against Tom Brady up 2.

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/boxscores/202210160pit.htm

The fighting Baker Mayfield’s did it against the Vikings this year.

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/boxscores/202309100min.htm#all_pbp

The issue with running the ball is that with 1:45 on the clock, one timeout or two is pretty much irrelevant against a top 5 QB. That’s why you throw the ball. And even though we slowed them down, they still went down and tied the game.

 

Wilson was 5-1 before it all went South. If Hackett keeps it simple who is to say. There is way too much talent on this team for it to completely implode, and if it does, that's totally on the coaching staff, all of it. Having a scrub at QB with limitations BUT with football smarts doesn't mean the party should end. I try to keep that in mind that this doesn't have to be as bad as it appears. Where I fault the Jets is stupidly putting all of their eggs in one basket. Now they're gonna scramble for a viable back up? F that. Stick with Wilson and let it ride. The bar on the season already fell lower than Hades, I'm not hanging it up before it even started. I'm all for being pleasantly surprised. Hopefully Wilson learned emotionally and psychologically from being taken down a peg and studied his ass off in response. Let's go Jets.

 

How do you look at it?

 

A "Top 5 QB" who was playing like a bottom 5 QB against a legit Top 5 defense. But the point is that there were other considerations besides Saleh not trusting Zach as "THE" reason.

 

Yes, I hope Saleh is getting himself more involved in the offense and can make decisions like telling Hackett to open things up and apply the "All gas, no brakes" mentality there too.

 

Idunno what you’re talking about. Most teams try to get the first down through the air in that situation to ice the game. The Jets didn’t even give the illusion that they’d try. They through a bunch of tightends on the field and took their one yard game.

 

So far, the Jets under Saleh have proven to be conservative on offense, no matter who the QB is. Yes, Saleh has gone for it on 4th down a few times, but by any measure he's not daring. And he believes in his defense. In that situation I think he felt the odds were better kicking the FG and relying on his defense to stop Allen - which they had done a good job of all game - than risking not making the 1st down and not getting any points. Up until a few years ago, this was exactly what most coaches would do.

I think there's more reason to believe that this is why he went for three than because he didn't trust Zach, but we'll never know.

Out of curiosity, would you have trusted Zach to get the 1st down and pass up the FG?

 

I would have thrown the ball on 3rd down if my dog was playing quarterback. I would’ve told that fleabag that they’ll never play QB for me again if they turn it over but you have to play to win the game. And mind you I have a friend that advocates for going for 4th downs all the time and I’m a big kick the FG guy.

There are also a lot of options there. Play action roll out with a high percentage pass/run/cross option and such.

Regardless, where I take issue with your statement is that you say “very few quarterbacks are trusted to throw the ball in that situation.” That’s blasphemy. It proves what they think of Wilson through and through.

 

That we need a kicker

 

I responded to those saying that everything that comes out of Saleh's mouth must be taken as gospel and cited last year's statements about Wilson, which many treated as gospel, that were reversed in short order. Coaches are free to say whatever they want with a purpose in mind, whether it's 100% truthful, to sidetrack an opponent or bolster someone's waning confidence - but we don't need to believe it's etched in stone. I believe the entire organization is negligent in not having another quarterback in the building now, Randall Cobb or not.

As far as Wilson today, anytime he's on the field he must be given more tools than he had Monday if he's going to build a successful game. I believe the coaching staff was deficient in not being more prepared for the inevitable when we all know that any player at any position can get knocked out of the game at any time.

 

Blasphemy? Oh puhleeze! Like I've offended the sainted nature QBs everywhere! What you keep refusing to acknowledge is the inherent conservative nature of all football coaches. If they were so "trusting" why do they insist on having every play called, only relinquishing that tight control to a very few QBs and occasions? Does Saleh trust Zach less than a 20 year future HOF QB? Of course he does! But does that mean he doesn't trust him at all? If that's the case why did he give him the freedom to audible out of the RPO that Zach did that resulted in the TD? Or was Zach going completely rogue there?

My original point is that you can't know that the CS doesn't trust Zach based on one play you pick, any more than I can say that they trust him completely off of one play. As I said before, each play in a game presents its own unique parameters that coaches (used to be QBs in the old days) have to consider and then make decisions on based on what their version of the odds tell them to do. On the FG play Saleh weighed it all and felt his "odds" favored taking the 3 and betting it would hold up. If Rogers was in there, he might well have let him go for it, but that doesn't prove he doesn't trust Zach, just that he doesn't trust him as much as a 20 year HOF QB.

 

I just gave you two examples of bottom of the barrel quarterbacks who were allowed to ice the game.

 

In those particular situations. As I said, the circumstances matter. And I gave you an example of where Zach was allowed to audible out of an RPO to throw that TD.

 

The only things I disagree with are Kyler Murray, Matt Ryan and Carson Wentz. Murray is very talented, but based on what I've read about him, he'd never learn the Jets' offense. Ryan is toast. He was awful last year. Wentz is no better than Zach and he's evidently a dick, because he quickly wears out his welcome, and no one wanted him this season. I don't think he would fit in with the character and attitude of the Jets. He would probably do more harm than good. I think that Minshew is probably the only QB the Jets could reasonably expect to add (and even he is very doubtful because of the injury to the Colts' starter) that would make an appreciable difference.

 

Exactly! Part of the reason Zach played so poorly is that he was playing not to make a mistake, which of course keeps a player uptight and causes mistakes and things like the yips on short throws. They need to show complete confidence, open the offense up and tell him to go get the Cowboys. He will probably still make some mistakes and an occasional bonehead decision like most gunslinging QBs do, but if they open things up, it may not be this week, but within a few weeks, I think we would see a much-improved version of the Zach from the Titans game of his rookie season. I think we'd start seeing his amazing arm talent, ability to fit the ball into tight windows, and his ability to sustain plays and create, all the reasons they made him the #2 pick in the draft.

 

LOL! Classic Jets humor!!! Well done!

 

I trust that the Jets know how good the Cowpokes' D is, so they will take it into account, but imo there is an exceedingly thin line between "cautious" and "playing scared." "Cautious" could mean running the ball on 1st and 2nd down, and only letting Zach pass on 3rd and long. That's a recipe for failure for Zach and the team and isn't "cautious" but is rather playing scared. IMO "cautious" means not being reckless and slinging the ball all over the field. There should be a middle ground where Hackett can show some of his supposed creativity and have Zach pass on 1st down or 2nd down, maybe add in a trick play or two to help keep the team loose and having fun. Throw screen passes to slow down the rush or do some of the patented Rodgers quick throw to the sidelines as soon as the ball is snapped for a 4-6 yard gain. That's like a good running play. It's hard to defend and is mostly safe. Take 1-2 deeps shots in the 1st half so the Cowpokes can't relax and keep 8-9 men in the box.

 

I agree. I don't think they'll have Zach slinging the ball all around, but they need to let him play, take some deep shots. Even if the ball intercepted 40-50 yards downfield, it's like a punt, but it also sends a message to the Cowpokes that they're risking getting burned if they try to stack the box.

I think they could keep him more limited this week, and gradually open things up over the next several weeks and that could work, but I also think they could just go ahead and open things up now (within reason, as you said not an aerial circus) and it could work. Keeping him limited or under wraps all season won't help him or the team. They have to show confidence in him. Hopefully, the rest of the offense is behind and supports Zach and are encouraging him that they believe in him. I'm not usually one for an "us against the world" kind of attitude, but perhaps as another poster said earlier in this thread that this could really serve to bring the team together and truly unite them and could be what Zach needs if the CS and players show that they believe in him and have his back. If he hasn't already, I'll bet that Rodgers will call Zach and tell him, 'You've got this! Go have fun and play like you know how to play."