Can you give some examples of Spielman? The two I could find make him look really good. Helping Washington get a guy who drafted Daniels and turned things around and his take on Rodgers' trade where he fully understood how GB did not have any leverage with 110 mil of his guaranteed salary they were never going to pay. What are some of the moronic ones? As far as Tanny low IQ, not sure about that, but objectively he was a successful executive for us. 7 seasons, only two losing seasons. 3 play-offs. 2 conf finals. 57-55 record, >.500 winning %.
I’m good with this. I really hope the Jets make the right decision, but 55+ years of history makes me lack confidence in them doing so.
Yes, the calls were with Manning, not anyone with an investment, responsibility or obligation to operate a professional sports franchise. Either Woody Johnson never spoke to the guy who fired Gase, or that guy screwed Johnson over big time by not warning him off his plan. I'm going with the former. Even though owners are essentially adversaries, I believe in this old boys club they call the NFL, there is a certain amount of honor among thieves.
Let's start with this: you cannot get employed football guys. They are employed by someone else. So, you don't want to get ANY football guys? Also, Tanny must be one lucky son of a bitch to have a record that he has when he has no knack on talent. Right now the question is: can he and Spielman identify a GM who has knack for talent and other aspects of a GM job. I think they have a chance, a much better one than Woody or any non football guys. Who exactly are you suggesting to help if not these guys? Woody and Chris to do on their own?
Up sell the idiots, down sell the good candidates and hope Woody defers to his usual gut instinct and Tannenbaum just might be able to get him a good GM after all...
@Borat When looking specifically at a GM, I personally put a heavier emphasis on selections in the top rounds because I know for sure it’s them making the picks, and not the scouts. I’ve heard it said that the rest of the selections (4-7) the GMs are just going by what the scouts say because they understandably don’t dive as deep on the prospects due to their other responsibilities. Spielmans selections at the top of the draft are hot garbage, WAY more busts than hits. Here are his top 2 picks in every draft: 2022 1 Lewis Cine DB (bust) 2 Andrew Booth CB (bust) 2021 1 Christian Darrisaw T (great player) 2 Kellen Mond QB Texas A&M (bust) 2020 1 Justin Jefferson WR (great player) 1 Jeff Gladney DB (bust) 2019 1 Garrett Bradbury C (bust) 2 Irv Smith TE (bust) 2018 1 Mike Hughes DB (bust) 2 Brian O'Neill T Pittsburgh (good pick) 2017 1 Dalvin Cook RB (great pick) 2 Pat Elflein (bust) 2016 1 Laquon Treadwell WR (bust) 2 Mackensie Alexander DB (bust) 2015 1 Trae Waynes DB (bust) 2 Eric Kendricks LB (solid) 2014 1 Anthony Barr LB (good pick) 2 Teddy Bridgewater QB (bust) 2013 1 Sharrif Floyd DT (bust) 1 Xavier Rhodes DB (great pick) 1 Cordarrelle Patterson WR (bust) 2012 1 Matt Kalil T (good pick) 1 Harrison Smith DB (great pick) 2011 1 Christian Ponder QB (bust) 2 Kyle Rudolph TE (great pick) 2010 2 Chris Cook DB (bust) 2 Toby Gerhart RB (bust) His picks the rest of those drafts are also bad. He lucked out with some later round studs like Diggs, Hunter, etc. which largely kept his team competitive despite him. I think it was Mike Zimmer that admitted he walked out of the draft room and essentially quit one year because Spielman kept making horrible selections. In listening to his podcasts, I most often disagree with his evaluations and vastly disagree on positional value. He’s a guy who still thinks it’s perfectly ok to take non-impactful positions (like rb, lb, s, TE) at the top of the draft. I personally don’t see what he’s done that anyone could think he’s any good.
Eh a lot of that is fair but some of it isn’t. For one, Jeff Gladney died in a car crash so it’s tough to hold that one against him. Perhaps not a star but Bradbury’s reliably been their starting center since he was drafted. Trae Waynes was a decent corner. Teddy Covers was a decent QB before his leg got smoked in half so another one that’s tough to hold against him. He beats the Seahawks in the playoffs if his kicker can make a 27 yarder..
Well you got 2 proven winners sitting at home in Bellichek and Pete Carroll. You could back a brinks truck up to either one and ask them to head up our football operations, but why not save some pennies to hire the guy we deemed wasn’t worthy of the job to hire a guy to do the job he wasn’t worthy of doing.
I don't think either one is too old to be coaching today, but I'm not so confident about three years down the road. If anyone is looking for a long term solution, it's neither of these guys.
Gladney was cut 1 year after he was picked as a first rounder, which almost never happens. He then died another year later after he was already out of the league. Wayne’s was absolutely a bust, I don’t think he even plays, please let me know if I’m wrong. I believe Bradbury was graded as a bottom half of the league center for most of his career, not what you want out of a first rounder.
He was cut after an alleged domestic violence incident in which he was found not guilty of. He was signed immediately after by the Cardinals. He started his entire rookie year so I have a hard time thrashing that pick. Wayne’s was fine. Middle of the road corner. You can call him a bust if you want but you are also trying to prove your point that the guy sucks as a GM and then you call his picks like Diggs, Hunter, etc. merely “lucky.”
I thought Kellen Mond was a 3d rounder and Teddy wasn't bad - even we fetched a 3d rounder for him years later. I also found this: "From 2010 to 2019, 12.5% of The Minnesota Vikings draft selections made the Pro Bowl [11] which was fourth best in the league". But again, I don't have his full record of every transaction as a GM - it is more than just draft. I do know he spent 16 years in Minny, made play-offs 6 times, 2 conf finals, 7 losing seasons, overall >.500 record. Say what you will about him, this is still a successful GM. With that said, I don't want him as a GM, and we are not hiring him to be a GM. He has enough of experience and success where he can help find a GM, just like he did for the Commies. I do think he is qualified for that role. Certainly a lot more than Woody and Chris.
We need to be realistic. Belicheat is not coming here and he can go fuck himself. He shits on the Jets every chance he gets. There is 0 chance of him helping us. Him coming here is not a serious conversation. Carroll - for what role are you envisioning him - GM? Or he would be ahead of GM? I already explained how having another football guy ahead of GM is a bad idea since it makes the GM job a lot less attractive. Also, while he may be good as a coach, I definitely do not want someone who can give two 1st round picks and a 3d for Jamal Adams to the be the GM. Right now we need to find a GM. If Pete Caroll was willing to help search for him, I wouldn't mind. But I do not want Carroll to be our GM or a VP of Operations, making the job less attractive for an actual GM. If he wants to coach the Jets, I would consider it, but we are not there yet - GM 1st.
Gentlemen, I believe you’re missing the best part of this. The redeeming part of this whole thing is 33rd team’s most recent addition. Back in September, they hired… …Adam Gase. No. Really. You could look it up.
They have a lot of players and coaches joining them in an advisory role, including Belichick as well. That doesn't mean they will be involved in a search. It's Tanny and Spielman. They have two more Executives there: Joe Banner and Jeff Diamond, but it is Tanny and Spielman who will be leading this.
I’m assuming you mean reding comprehension for you. I know damned well how their role was stated. If they will advise on both candidates for GM and HC that absolutely takes away from the new GM role to make his own selection. Let the new GM decide who he wants for HC. Unless Woody wants both reporting to him, another massive mistake. That was my point The rest of your wordy paragraphs did nothing to respond to my point.
They don’t have to have any role, just pay them to be a consultant in hiring the right people. To do what we just hired Tannenbaum to do. Just a funny aside, someone listed Spielman’s dismal record drafting and had Cordarelle Patterson at 29 as a bust. That year Tannenbaum was advocating the Jets take him at 9 overall in his newfound analyst role. This is beyond stupid, how are we even discussing this? We just hired two terrible GM’s to hire a GM for us. If they’re so smart why not just hire one of them?
I think you underestimate the benefit of having a director of football operations if for no other reason than to insulate those operations from ownership. I see additional benefit in having someone to facilitate cooperation between the coaching and management staffs. A football honcho could or would also direct operation of medical, training and dietary staff and the training facility itself to raise it to state of the art level.
Apparently you have a problem even comprehending what you write. Your words, bolding added: "Why do they need to select both the GM and the coach." There is a significant difference between selecting something and advising on it. 33rd Team will be selecting nothing.
