Mario Williams = BEAST

Not to mention the only negative things people on this board say and/or know about D'Brick is what they heard Mel Kiper say, which is that he got beat by Daryl Tapp during the year and needs improvement in the run. I never heard anyone say anything else with their case against D'Brick because they know nothing beyond what they heard on ESPN. They can say "well Daryl Tapp beat him" all they want, but they dont know that Virginia Tech's defense was crazy last year, anchored by one the best front 4's in the nation. I never heard them mention how D'Brick shutdown Shawne Merriman and Jason Babin.

 

i fail to understand is this "Brick or Bust" mentality.

it seems like the people who clamor for Brick think the OL won't be fixed unless we draft him.

do y'all really think the coaches will neglect the OL this year? i highly highly doubt it. either way, the OL will be vastly improved.

drafting Mario and fixing the OL appeals more to me than drafting Brick and fixing the OL.




cheers

 

If that is what you think, you're way off. Ferguson is the top OT in a deep class that lacks the elite level talent. He is not on the Pace, Ogden, Jones, Gallery level as a prospect. With all the holes we have (LT not being one of them), it would be foolish to waste a draft pick on him.

 

mario williams has been as much of a prospect as brick has since day 1. if thats what is really being debated here thats pointless.

the main argument people have against d'brick is drafting him makes A.Jones a waste and with the OL depth this yr solidifying another position at 4 and finding a player with little dropoff in the 29th pick up to the 3rd rd.

people who want d'brick just see a promising talent solidifying a position on a line that looked horrendous last yr so it seems simple since he'll most likely be there at 4.

its whatever you choose, i'd pick williams before i do brick because brick seems strictly to only fit LT. plus i agree with the argument of OL depth. while I only see two AMAZING DL in Williams and Bunkley.

plus id also say Mario is the more rare of player, there will always bee strong athletic people, but hes that plus a rare combination of size. plus im biased as ive taken notice of him since he started as a true freshman.

thats just me tho

 

Oh, so im talking crazy and made all that stuff up. Its kinda hard to be a top 4 pick 2 yrs running and not be considered "Elite." Sorry if i want D'Brick over Adrian Jones as opposed to Kimo/Ellis over Mario. Kimo/Ellis dont seem to be glaring weaknesses to me.

 

I really don't see how Adrian Jones was a glaring weakness once he moved to left tackle. There's no chance Ferguson was a top five pick in 2005, so I wouldn't go there. They have the same amount of upside, and both play the same position. They are built the same way and have the same weaknesses and strengths. One would cost us a top five pick, one cost us a fourth rounder. I really don't get the lovefest for D'Brick. Clearly no one watched him play if they think he's miles ahead of Adrian Jones. He's a sub par run blocker at best, at that.

Mario would play rush backer, so he's an upgrade over Bryan Thomas, which would be a huge upgrade.

 

Wow, stop making so much sense. Seriously. That's not allowed.

:rofl2:

 

Thomas is going to do well in Mangini's system - I would be very surprised the Jets will be willing to dish out the $$$$ a 4th pick will cost them for a defensive end. I think their going DT with their 1st pick.

 

Ferguson isn't anywhere close to being the best LT prospect of the past decade, not by a mile.

 

I think you guys are not considering two points? If you pass on Williams, how hard is it to get an excellent player at his position later in the draft or through free agency vs. if you pass on Brick, how hard is it to get a player, later in the draft or through free agency, that can do the job he is expected to do. I think most folks would say it is much harder to find the DE later than the OT.
Second point. Which of these players has the greatest potential to make the opponents alter their game plan? It seems to me that Williams has it there, too.
Finally, the landscape is littered with the skeletons of high draft pick tackles that never made it - more so than 6'7" phyisical monster defensive ends. For those reasons, we pick Wiliams unless Leinert falls to 4.

 

Here is a list of tackles taken in the first 3 rounds in the past decade...

Year No. Round Pick Player Name Team College
2005 1 1 13 13 Jammal Brown Saints Oklahoma
2 1 19 19 Alex Barron Rams Florida State
3 2 9 41 Michael Roos Titans Eastern Washington
4 2 17 49 Marcus Johnson Vikings Mississippi
5 2 20 52 Khalif Barnes Jaguars Washington
6 2 32 64 Adam Terry Ravens Syracuse
7 3 27 91 Chris Colmer Buccaneers North Carolina State
8 3 29 93 Trai Essex Steelers Northwestern
2004 1 1 2 2 Robert Gallery Raiders Iowa
2 1 16 16 Shawn Andrews Eagles Arkansas
3 2 20 52 Jacob Rogers Cowboys USC
4 3 12 75 Max Starks Steelers Florida
5 3 31 94 Travelle Wharton Panthers South Carolina
2003 1 1 8 8 Jordan Gross Panthers Utah
2 1 20 20 George Foster Broncos Georgia
3 1 26 26 Kwame Harris 49ers Stanford
4 2 5 37 Jonathan Stinchcomb Saints Georgia
5 3 9 73 Wayne Hunter Seahawks Hawaii
6 3 11 75 Seth Wand Texans Northwest Missouri State
7 3 14 78 Wade Smith Dolphins Memphis
2002 1 1 4 4 Mike Williams Bills Texas
2 1 7 7 Bryant McKinnie Vikings Miami (FL)
3 1 10 10 Levi Jones Bengals Arizona State
4 1 29 29 Marc Colombo Bears Boston College
5 2 8 40 Mike Pearson Jaguars Florida
6 2 21 53 Langston Walker Raiders California
7 3 13 78 Jeff Hatch Giants Pennsylvania
2001 1 1 2 2 Leonard Davis Cardinals Texas
2 1 14 14 Kenyatta Walker Buccaneers Florida
3 1 18 18 Jeff Backus Lions Michigan
4 2 12 43 Maurice Williams Jaguars Michigan
5 2 17 48 Matt Light Patriots Purdue
6 3 17 79 Kareem McKenzie Jets Penn State
7 3 33 95 Jonas Jennings Bills Georgia
2000 1 1 3 3 Chris Samuels Redskins Alabama
2 1 20 20 Stockar McDougle Lions Oklahoma
3 1 22 22 Chris McIntosh Seahawks Wisconsin
4 2 7 38 Marvel Smith Steelers Arizona State
5 2 13 44 Chad Clifton Packers Tennessee
6 2 15 46 Adrian Klemm Patriots Hawaii
7 2 22 53 Todd Wade Dolphins Mississippi
8 2 30 61 Bobby Williams Eagles Arkansas
9 3 21 83 Damion McIntosh Chargers Kansas State
1999 1 1 14 14 John Tait Chiefs Brigham Young
2 1 18 18 Matt Stinchcomb Raiders Georgia
3 1 19 19 Luke Petitgout Giants Notre Dame
4 1 21 21 L.J. Shelton Cardinals Eastern Michigan
5 1 27 27 Aaron Gibson Lions Wisconsin
6 2 3 34 Chris Terry Panthers Georgia
7 2 6 37 Jon Jansen Redskins Michigan
8 2 24 55 Solomon Page Cowboys West Virginia
9 3 5 66 Rex Tucker Bears Texas A&M
10 3 13 74 Kris Farris Steelers UCLA
1998 1 1 7 7 Kyle Turley Saints San Diego State
2 1 11 11 Tra Thomas Eagles Florida State
3 1 23 23 Mo Collins Raiders Florida
4 1 27 27 Victor Riley Chiefs Auburn
5 2 6 36 Anthony Clement Cardinals Southwestern Louisiana
6 2 8 38 Flozell Adams Cowboys Michigan State
7 2 17 47 Todd Weiner Seahawks Kansas State
8 3 5 66 Chris Conrad Steelers Fresno State
9 3 7 68 Robert Hicks Bills Mississippi State
10 3 28 89 Chris Ruhman 49ers Texas A&M
1997 1 1 1 1 Orlando Pace Rams Ohio State
2 1 6 6 Walter Jones Seahawks Florida State
3 1 19 19 Tarik Glenn Colts California
4 2 5 35 Juan Roque Lions Arizona State
5 2 7 37 Jerry Wunsch Buccaneers Wisconsin
6 2 18 48 Adam Meadows Colts Georgia
7 3 12 72 Adam Treu Raiders Nebraska
8 3 21 81 Scott Sanderson Oilers Washington State
9 3 22 82 Paul Wiggins Steelers Oregon
10 3 25 85 Tim Kohn Raiders Iowa State
11 3 36 96 Brent Smith Dolphins Mississippi State
1996 1 1 4 4 Jonathan Ogden Ravens UCLA
2 1 10 10 Willie Anderson Bengals Auburn
3 1 27 27 John Michels Packers USC
4 1 29 29 Jamain Stephens Steelers North Carolina A&T
5 1 30 30 Andre Johnson Redskins Penn State
6 3 16 77 Robert Barr Seahawks Rutgers

I think we can all agree that although D'Brick may not have the careers that many of these players have had, him and Pace are probably the best prospects from this era. If it was any other draft, there would be no question that D'Brick would be going within the top 3...

 

Ogden, Pace, Samuels, Davis, Gallery were all better prospects than Ferguson coming out.

 

well if you looked at this past seasons pro bowl rosters, you'll see that ALL the Tackles were 1st rd picks, mostly high 1st rounders at that:

Walter Jones - Rd 1 pick 6
Orlando Pace - Rd 1 pick 1
Chris Samuels - Rd 1 pick 3
Willie Anderson - Rd 1 pick 10
Jonathan Ogden - Rd 1 pick 4
Tarik Glenn - Rd 1 pick 19
Willie Roaf - Rd 1 pick 8

Outside of Tarik Glenn, all the tackles were top 10 picks

Now for the pro bowl DEs:
Dwight Freeney - Rd 1 pick 11
Derek Burgess - Rd 3 pick 1
Kyle Vanden Bosch - Rd 2 pick 3
Jason Taylor - Rd 3 pick 13
Julius Peppers - Rd 1 pick 2
Michael Strahan - Rd 2 pick 11
Osi Umenyiora - Rd 2 pick 24

Only 2 DEs were 1st rd picks, the rest 2nd and 3rd rounders

 

I was just responding to your statement that "Ferguson isn't anywhere close to being the best LT prospect of the past decade, not by a mile"..

if you could only mentioned 5 tackles that were better prospects than him (I only agree with 3) than he is well within a mile of him being one of the best tackle prospects in the last decade

 

I think it is easy to say that both D'brick and Mario are great prospect and that it is ones opinion of who is more of a vaule. They both could be all pros and they both could suck. Both postions are important but with that being said I would rather play against D'brick then I would Mario.

 

We are running out of things to talk about someone make a poll that has D'Brick and Mario going head to head.

 

That's twice now you have said D'Brick isn't on the same level as those guys...want to say it again?

 

That explains how he has 17,000 post.

 

Maybe thats a good thing because Robert Gallery and Mike Williams were both touted as guys that were the best to come out in a decade or so...

The Adrian Jones hype makes me want shave my balls with a spoon...We had one of the worst offensive lines in the NFL for a reason. Adrian would be a good fill in if we already had a talented Oline...Just as an example...if we had signed on Jones back in 04 when we had...

Kendall at LG, Mawae at C, Moore at RG and McKenzie at RT...in that circumstance Jones probably could have had alot of success with all that talent...BUT we dont have a line that anymore.

I am not saying D'Brick is the only guy you should want, but it is so dumb to completey rule him out because of a average player like Adrian Jones...