That's not the totality of the situation, though. Point is a system can put an average or good QB in a situation where he is able to put up great statistics for a season or two but in the end he is still just an average or good QB. in the long term that is what history will reveal him to be despite a few seasons or games of great statistics. There is no shame in a QB just being good and benefiting from the system, but there are some people who want to clearly ignore the system is the primary reason for the offensive statistical success and the QB is clearly benefiting from it. It is a fortunate situation for the QB to be in that they have enough skill and ability to command that system.
Are you truly confused by the fact that asserting an offensive system can elevate an average QB's stats and play for short periods doesn't equate to asserting that it will do so for every single QB that plays in it, or are you just unaware how illogical a question you asked really is?
That's not the relevant question since the actual topic is the offensive system. The honest question is what are these offensive systems that seem to elevate QB stats beyond their historical success and performances. You have to ask the relevant and logical questions if you want to have an honest discussion.
you are crediting Kelly w/ Foles and now Sanchez off to a good start, so why is Barkley struggling? why didn't Vick take off? the system thing is an excuse being used to bash Mark again. just answer the question and stop dancing.
I wish Kelly was coaching here in NY. I am a big fan of his style and coaching philosophies. Had we fired Rex after 2012's disaster he could very well have been the coach right now and Sanchez/Geno Smith could be thriving here.
and then fans would be complaining about the defense. Kelly after 1 year, 1 playoff app, lost home playoff game Rex after 1 year, 1 playoff app, 2 road playoff wins, title game app
You've intimated that Manning's success in 2013 was a product of a system. This is now the third time that I am asking you to go into detail about that system and how it made him successful. The problem is, you don't know how to go into detail about it. You're dodging the argument because you have no understanding of the system you are pretending to know about. Report all you want, you're the biggest troll on this forum and the Mods have now caught on.
I was told - and this is coming from Curtis Painter, of all people - that Peyton's system could fit in a single sheet of A4 paper. [You can find a lot of other sources saying just the same thing, starting from his offense under Tom Moore and etc, by the way.] Of course that doesn't mean defense can stop him. We all know what happened last year. It took a caliber of Championship defense to throttle Peyton; and Seahawks got a lot of gifts along the way, starting from the 1st possession safety to boot. In other words; Peyton Manning IS the system. Product of a system? - my fucking ass. [But then, I do not think soxxx knew this.]
Back to Sanchez discussion: So this situation brings us back to the question I threw out a few weeks ago: Who sucked more? Brian Schottenheimer? Or Mark Sanchez? I am still saying Brian Schottenheimer is a total bullshit of a coordinator that shouldn't even have been given the post in the first place. He sucks big hairy goat balls.
You always sell him short, junc. The guy designs drives standing behind his Oline while defenses adjust. He's a machine. Maybe that's the reason he gets hammered late in the postseason most years, too, but he's like a football computer with a great release.
Interesting, thanks for sharing and I can definitely see that. They do run a lot of the same plays over and over, and in Denver that they ran in Indy. The complexity is Peyton's ability to pick and choose at the line with his amazing ability to read the defense. Just a couple of examples.... -Peyton's teams have typically loved to run the shotgun handoff up the middle (when he reads the defense pinning back at the line) -Peyton's teams have typically loved to run the pass play with the tight end up the seam as well (when he reads the safeties chasing the WRs or moving in at the line) -Post routes in the red zone as well. They don't waste their time running like a lot of complex screens or rollouts really. I could see their playbook being small for sure. The whole system is Manning and his amazing ability to read on the fly. That's why I think he could play into his 40s and when he does hang it up he will be a truly amazing offensive coordinator /HC.
can't do it when the lights are brightest, that knocks him down a few pegs for me. all the records are meaningless when he does what he did in the SB a few months ago. the man has had top 5 weapons around him his entire career but it is always the fault of those around him no matter that the players change. He's obviously an all time great but he has been a major disappointment in big games and that goes all the way back to college through the end of his NFL career.
- Did it ever occur to you that those weapons would probably not have achieved Top 5 level without being groomed by their QB?
No it hasn't as I have seen them have success w/ other QBs too. I remember hearing about how he made Pierre Garcon, Pierre seems to be doing ok w/ the mess in DC. I heard he made reggie Wayne, reggie seems to be doing fine w/o him. the latest was he made Decker- the same guy who caught 8 TDs from Tebow and Orton in 2011. Peyton is great, he dos make players around him more productive, but he's not taking Chaz Schilens and winning, he's not winning w/ what Brady has had most of his career.
NO I never said Mannings success was because of the system, I said the system took Manning to a level we had never seen before. If you really want me to break the whole thing down, I will, do you want me to compare the 2004 season to the 2013 season? Is that fair enough? ill put his 2 best season against each other and explain to you how they were VERY different and it had a lot to do with the play calling and the philosophy of Gase's offense that he created.
