Yes, the team needs stability, but that only comes with success. Keeping an incompetent GM or HC just in the name of stability is death to a franchise. It's what we Jets fans have endured for too long. There have been too many bad hires that have been stuck with for far too long trying to give them every chance to succeed, when they had no chance to succeed. Stability comes from the top down. One needs a knowledgeable owner, or an experienced, knowledgeable VP of Football Operations to run the team. That man decides upon offensive and defensive systems that he believes in and sticks with them. When a coaching change has to be made, he hires someone who runs those systems. That, more than anything else has killed the Jets. We have not had a knowledgeable owner or football man calling the shots since Weeb Ewbank. Almost every time a head coaching change has been made (maybe every time), the systems have changed, and we've had to turn over the roster to get the right players for the new system.
lol, some screens and bubbles are ok, but let's hope it's more than that or the D will just crowd the line. Same topic, with Herndon out, why not more creativity with Enunwa? He's position flexible and can create mismatches.
While I think this probably is true, in a normal, competent situation, FJF's point stands as a good one. There's no way Chris Johnson or Douglas should listen to the fan base. Chris Johnson because he doesn't have enough knowledge to weed out the bad from the good suggestions, and Douglas shouldn't listen because I believe he knows more than all of us put together.
If it's true that Sam struggled reading the D yesterday, and true that Sam is a quick learner, he will learn from yesterday. At least he'd better, as I suspect that every team we face over the next several weeks will seek to emulate what Buffalo did until Sam and Gase prove that they have an answer for it. In a way, I think it is good that Sam struggled in his first game. Last year, after a mistake or struggling, he learned from it and came back strong. He is resilient, and I think he will learn and come back strong from this. The OL getting in sync/gelling and perhaps Gase devising some ways to slow down opponents' rush/pressure on Sam will go a long way to helping Sam.
Sam the problem is you either don't know what you're arguing or you can't express yourself. Even the fools on this board who point to Gase's time in Miami know that he didn't develop Tannenhill he simply had a winning record with him when he started and he was playing with backup QB's the last two years in Miami. The extension argument is nonsense and to deny you made it when you just made it again makes you look like a tool. Sam, I'm trying to help you because you do occasional come up with nuggets but since you can't express yourself clearly you think everyone else is dumb. Guess what I'm reading your posts if I'm getting it wrong maybe that's on you. The reality is we have a crappy OL and crappy WR. That limits what you can do downfield against a top 3 NFL D. When you have a big lead against a bottom NFL O and their D is trying to turn you over not turning it over is a smart play. Taking a shot over the top is a smart play. Missing on it was all execution. We did try and take the top off the Bills D. We missed.
I think Montgomery would've gotten more snaps if the offensive line wasn't getting abused so much. to play Bell & Montgomery at the same time you have to sacrifice a tight end. The offensive line couldn't stop Buffalo's front on their own. A tight end was needed just to have additional help on that line, sadly. --- but if Gase answered the question that way, people would've cried that he "threw the offensive line under the bus" or whatever.
It's not good he struggled, it's not good our kicking game stinks and our D fell apart down the stretch. The entire O is going to have to execute much better. It's not just on Sam. It's one game in his development. I like the fact that he didn't turn it over under pressure. I hate the fact that he's extremely limited by the OL and our receivers. I'm hopeful that once Bell has gotten back into game shape he takes a much bigger role in filling some of the other short comings in our roster. I like Sam a lot, I have no issue with Gase extending what he can do in game situations as personal, score, down and distance dictate. We are severally limited by the overall talent on our O. Robbie Anderson is a situational WR on most good NFL teams. I'm amazed that people think Sam is a magician.
I told you exactly what I was arguing: Gase the coach, the person, the boss. I NEVER TALKED ABOUT FOOTBALL. The only reason I started talking about it is because someone else responded to me talking about how I should be fine with Gase being a dick that can't hold himself accountable because of all the good work he did in Miami and how average he made Tannehill. I repeat: I DID NOT BRING UP TANNEHILL. Someone else brought up Gase's work with Tannehill, I simply responded and the irony is we have the same friggen opinion. He didn't develop Tannehill. I really feel like I wasn't too hard to follow on this one. Also what are you talking about me denying I made the about this being an extension of what we saw him Miami? I never denied it. I absolutely said that what we saw Sunday was an extension of what we saw in Miami because it was. We played without a lead or a very small one for the entire first half and the offense was as vanilla as it gets so you theory about protecting a lead goes out the window there. Do you think we signed Crowder because Gase wants to start ripping off chunk plays through the air, or because he wants to follow the exact same gameplan he had in Miami with Albert Wilson? I'm confused as to how you're confused. Here's the TL;DR: -Gase came of insecure and testy, which he has a history of. This is what my main point was from the get-go. -When someone brought up football I responded with why the football points were bad. -I 10000% believe that what we saw offensively was an extension of what we saw in Miami because it was the exact same gameplan.
Gase's game plan worked. The kicker and the D's collapse is what cost the Jets the win. I can understand the criticism of Gase's game plan if it had failed miserably, the Jets were blown out and Gase made no adjustments. That's not what happened, however. They led the whole game and should have won. I can also understand this criticism if Gase's game plans and play calling continue the same way for the whole season. Then I think most of us will be unhappy. It was the first game, the first time our starting offense had played together and they had little practice time together due to injuries and Kalil coming in late. They were playing a top 5 D. I'm sure those are the reasons that Gase went with the game plan that he did. If the OL gels in a game or two, plays well, and Gase continues to call the same kind of conservative offense and game plan, then your criticism and comparing it to what he did in Miami will be justified. Right now it just comes across as panic, or you're trying to prove that you were right that he shouldn't have been hired. Given that we only have 3 WRs on the roster worth a damn, are missing our starting TE, and the OL is playing like crap, would you have been confident in opening up the offense? It seems to me that the way this team is put together, the best way to go is with a ball control offense. Take enough deep shots to keep opposing Ds from stacking 8-9 men in the box, but utilize Bell and Montgomery on routes out of the backfield, run the ball, throw some intermediate routes to Herndon, Enunwa, and Crowder. Opening the offense up and throwing the ball all over the field when Sam isn't reading the Ds well is a recipe for failure. Opening the offense up and throwing the ball downfield when Sam is getting chased, pounded and sacked is a recipe for getting Sam seriously injured. Outside of Tunsil, Miami didn't have a good OL while Gase was there. Did you ever think that maybe, just maybe, that's why he went with a short passing offense there? It can be just like running the ball and limits TOs and should help maximize time of possession, keeping the ball out of the other offense's hands.
No. How 'bout "our fault". That's the point. Look I can see why to many this would seem like a refreshing perspective after Bowles' deadbeat pressers. But I can only hope that if/when this year turns to rat shit we don't make the mistake of doubling down and prolonging the agony because, as everyone knows, in every scenario, good and bad, it takes time to move up in this ultra competitive league. Gase is not a leader of men. His personality is not suited to the HC role. And NY is not Miami. If/when things go seriously southbound he will be savaged in the media. Idk if he can handle that without a meltdown with resulting turmoil within the team.
I don't know how an offense that scored 8 points "worked". When they needed to score, they couldn't. The offense failed. The gameplan failed. He made no adjustments. He didn't put the team in the best position to win considering his playcalling and personnel decisions. This could very well be a 1 week thing and by week 8 we're throwing comeback routes and posts and back shoulder fades but I'm not willing to say it was all just a coincidence that his offense here looked the exact same as his offense in Miami. That's WAY too coincidental.
In your opinion they were bad decisions. In others' opinion, they weren't. The same thing goes for your comments about his being insecure and not holding himself accountable. It's all perspective and opinion, and we already know that you're extremely biased against Gase, so you're looking for things to criticize him about. You're perspective isn't fair and balanced. In short, you have an agenda. Gase saw that his game plan worked yesterday. It was undermined by the lousy kicker, Sam struggling reading the Bills' D, some failures in execution, and our D collapsing. It was enough to win. Take away any one of those things and the Jets win. Gase has more experience coaching and devising game plans than all of us put together. It's very easy for us to sit back and criticize when we haven't seen practices or have any knowledge of what the players are thinking and doing in practice. Gase went with a game plan that he thought gave us the best chance to win yesterday. I can't fault him for that. Even if in time it is proven that yesterday's game plan was a failure, every coach has had game plans fail. The key is what Gase's game plans and play calling will look like when he sees solid OL play giving Sam plenty of time to throw the ball and opening holes for Bell and Montgomery.
No, it's not good that our kicking game stinks, that our OL and CBs suck, and that our D fell apart down the stretch. In an ideal world, the Jets would have won yesterday and Sam wouldn't have struggled. The thing is, however, we learn more from adversity, and struggle, than we do from success. Since Sam is still a work in progress and learning, I don't think it's the end of the world that he struggled. I think he will learn from yesterday and it will make him a better QB in the long run. I hate that he's limited by our OL and WRs too, but it is what it is. Sam can learn from that too. If he can at least get solid OL play, he can use his creativity and mobility to make things happen like he did last year.
Listen, if you can watch Gase's presser and not see a guy who is dodging any and all blame while squirming in his seat when asked questions he doesn't want to answer (like he did in Miami) then you have just as much of an "agenda" as I do. This was the lazy way out by you. It's not out of line AT ALL to question the way Gase handles himself which is why people have questioned it for going on four years.
You can go with 21 personnel instead of 3 WR sets, without sacrificing the TE. On longer down and distance situations, Montgomery could have played a role more similar to Herndon as well. There were ways to get him involved.
It "worked" because with better execution, the Jets' offense would have scored more. It worked because the Jets led the whole game until the 4th Qtr. Normally, when a home team creates 4 TOs they win 99% of the time. You conveniently ignore the fact that the starting offense has not played together in a game, and that the starting OL even had relatively few practices together, and that we are missing our starting TE. Griffin is not Herndon and so that limits what Gase can do as well, and we were playing against one of the best Ds in the NFL. That definitely has an impact on any offense, but particularly one that has had little practice time together and no game time together prior to the game against that top defense. You also didn't respond to my question in my 2nd paragraph or comment on what type of game plan or offense you'd have given our limitations with the OL and WRs.
An offense that scores 8 points did not work! Holy crap. Imagine for two seconds that this was Bowles and Bates. Every single person would be calling for their heads and not a single damn person would be trying to convince other people that the offense WORKED. I also didn't ignore anything. Either in this thread or another one I made a whole post defending Sam because of how little cohesion the unit has due to how little they've played together. Asking a fan what they would do to fix a broken offense is useless and again, the lazy way out. For starters I would have used every weapon I had to try and generate any kind of movement whatsoever which involves Montgomery. Playing him 5 snaps was a major gaffe. I understand what having two RBs does to the line, but if you're a supposed offensive genius you should probably be able to find a way to make a two RB set work with a TE on the field as an extra blocker.
No, your mind is made up. You have an agenda. You don't like Gase and you have him under a microscope looking for any potential flaw or mistake so you can point it out. You can't even admit your own bias. I have no agenda. If you will recall, I was totally, vehemently against hiring Gase even though I wanted someone with an offensive background and who had prior experience as a HC. I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt however. One game and post-game press conference doesn't enough evidence to prove anything. I'm being rational, my emotions are out of the equation. I'm going to wait and see how the whole season plays out. If the offense continues to struggle, to be conservative, then I'll start getting antsy, having doubts and I'm sure getting frustrated. That hasn't happened yet, however, and I'm not going to project that it will because of what happened in Miami. The clear evidence for me would be that if when the Jets start getting at least solid, if not quality OL play if Gase remains as conservative in his game plans and play calling, and if he then doesn't acknowledge his mistakes. Until then, I am impartial. It's funny that you claim I am being lazy. I am using my mind and thinking rationally and logically. You aren't. You're going strictly on your biases and emotions. I think you may have even said in one post that if it was a rookie HC you'd give him the benefit of the doubt and be patient, but since Gase has a track record you won't. Even if you didn't say that, I think you would give the benefit of the doubt to a rookie HC and wouldn't be so quick to criticize him given our lousy OL that has had no time to gel, Herndon being out, and our underwhelming WR corps. If not, then you would simply be impatient and dealing with the reality of the situation.
LOL Whatever. You're the only one that is being lazy intellectually, and I'll add absurdly over-wrought emotionally. It's pointless to continue the conversation, because your mind is sealed shut. You've already convicted Gase, and nothing anyone says or that Gase does positively will convince you otherwise. Good luck with that.
This is a dumb convo. Gase was roasted for being a prick in Miami, players didn't like him, he fought with ownership. Yesterday he was a prick to the media, wouldn't take any responsibility and tossed players under the bus. This isn't a "me" thing. This is a Gase thing. I'm not making it up because of what you perceive my "agenda" to be.
