Farve, Manning, Montanna... Clemens is destined for the HOF. Just because some other guys played QB too....
This is the last time I'll respond to you because I'm getting to the point where I want to say things that would surely get me banned. The POINT is that it is too early to make a decision as to whether or not he can be a good NFL QB. The POINT is that people with similar beginnings have turned out to be very good NFL QB's. Using someone who turned out shitty doesn't make the point. If you don't understand this then I feel sorry for you.
this was/is a stupid post. there is no way to compare the beginnings of QB's in different scenarios, that have different tools, to use, and work with. there was no point in using stats just to try to add justification. it was an attempt to justify clemens staying in at QB, and remain for "the plan". but out of all these players mentioned, clemens looks the farthest behind at this point in all their collective careers. the stats only narrowed the gap of reality that lies between them all. i hope and pray that clemens turns into a manning, palmer, montana, farve, etc... but he doesnt look like it no matter how you spin it.
Whatever. So use comparisons of Hall Of Famers and pro-bowlers only? People with "similar beginnings" have also sucked too. Just like the double standard BS of the bad Oline and WR drops. Chad had the same 10 guys along side him in the huddle.
With the exception of the Cowboys game Clemens has had the Jets in position to win or tie at the end in every game he's started. Against Cleveland the coaching staff took the ball out of his hands at the end. If you don't see the difference between what Chad has contributed (meaningless check downs ad nauseum) and what Clemens has (a fighting chance) then you really do not understand NFL football at all. Clemens has not been good enough (what QB's are in their first half dozen starts?) but he's been better than Chad at leading this team when he was behind center.
Translation: OMG I am a pissed off Jet fan and need to piss on anything rational said about any young player ever mentioned on this site, be it Revis, Harris, Clemens etc. etc. Please stop replying to my posts as you add nothing absolutely nothing to this site. You are just a freaking troll! Yes I am calling you out!
If you wanted to prove that it is too early to pass judgement, why didn't you have Palmer and then one of the million other busts that had similar stats after 5 games to show that stats really don't mean anything by themselves and the QB has to be judge by physical evaluation?
To prove something like that to you is frankly impossible. This thread really was not meant for you. I mean there is no way in hell that KC is ever going to replace the living legend that is Chad. Yeah I get that.
Maybe if I quote you, clearly stating my intentions, schmucks like the guy you are replying to may get the point.
Clemens has gotten worse not better, it's true a QB will suck with a bad line, but, at least, he should be doing better by this time than the guy he has replaced,given the fact they both play behind the same line with the same supporting cast. Do you think that if Brady came in and sucked or did worse than Bledsoe that Belichek would have annointed him the starter? Didn't Chad look much better with a good defense, a better line and with Curtis Martin in the backfield? I'm not saying we have to keep Pennington or should, cause his arm may be compromised due to the surgeries, but at least lets get us a solid QB and not waste time on this guy, even giving him the credit he desrves for having a nice arm, and being able to run. He is not accurate and is already panicking in the pocket.
So your point is he could be one of the best ever or a total bust? To illustrate this you compare him to 2 #1 overall pick franchise QBs, yet not any on the other side of the argument?
I absolutely think it is too early to pass judgment, but I don't see how comparing Kellen's stats to Mannings and Palmers proves this point. What it says to me is anyone who thinks that Kellen might not be the future franchise QB of the Jets is a complete idiot, look at Manning and Palmer. If that is not what you meant then fine.
I am not trying to belabor the point with you. Look I understand because you love Chad so much that the next QB is not going to be liked or given leeway no matter what. I understand that as evidenced by you replying to every KC/Chad thread on 3 different sites. Look this thread is not for you. How many times can I explain what the intent of this thread was .............. To show it is simply too early to pass judgment on him. Seriously what is so difficult to understand?
That's not the point. The point is that Clemens first half dozen starts are no better nor worse than MOST QB's first half dozen starts, including a bunch of people who have done very well and a bunch who have not and a bunch in between. We just don't know where Clemens is on that scale right now and we won't until the Jets line improves.
Bradway, Honest question? You are pretty negative on the long term prospects for this FO/CS but are great contributor to this site.............. The fact that KC probably requires a complete season with a decent O-line and at least another WR, not named Justin McCareins, to accurately gauge whether he is going to be a QB of the future that difficult to understand?
Of course, like most of us Jets fans here I'm nervous about the situation and I want to at least make sure he is better than Pennington, and I definatly don't see that from him at all. Do you think it would be wise to keep Chad as a backup? We did have that nice win in Pittsburgh with Kellen but he seems to have really blew up since the Dallas game.
It's not difficult to understand, however there are other points of view - rational or otherwise. I'm just continually reframing the argument for giving Clemens more time because I think it's too early to say anything definitive about him. I think he has a lot of competitive fire in him and I think he has a good arm and I'm hoping that when the other factors necessary are in place that'll turn into a good QB. I definitely think we are ahead of where we would be if we were going into next year's draft needing to draft a QB.
I'd say at the very least we have to give him a complete training camp and preseason as the #1 guy followed by 8 - 10 more regular season games. If at that point he hasn't progressed significantly from what we're seeing now, we need to start looking elsewhere. A lot of people think it should be at least 16 more regular season games.
