3-4 alignment had it's greatest value when fewer than five teams were running it. For example, there was a point in the late 90's when only 2 or 3 teams were using at all. On draft day, 30-ish teams were fighting for elite pass rushing DEs and hulking LBs. 3-4 teams could pick up great undersized linebackers in the 5th round, and space-eating DEs as UDFAs. Plus, some offenses went two or three years without playing against a 3-4, and they wouldn't know how to handle it. These days, there is much less of a competitive advantage.
I like Dupree. Hes a good athlete w a versatile skillset due to his size. Maybe not the weakside speed rusher we all crave but i think Calvin Pace would be a fair comparison.
My point was Dupree is going to cost as much as Ngakoue and simply isn't as good.. yes he got double digit sacks this year but never got above 6 until he had a legit pass rusher opposite him. We can get the same thing out of Jenkins if not more if we have a legit pass rusher (which dupree is not). Judon I think maybe cheaper. Fowler will cost less but like you I'm not sure his ability. But I put Lawson right there with him. They are both up and down. As for not drafting one, you don't spent 7 picks all on offense. I think we can get a corner in fa easier than a true edge. If an great option is there you don't pass it up. I would prefer to fill as many whole by draft as possible so we can focus on getting better. But in no way do we spend all 7 picks on offense especially if a good edge or CBs is available in rounds 3-6
I totally disagree that Dupree will cost as much as Ngakoue. He doesn't have nearly the production and is older than Ngakoue. You speak as if adding a Dupree or Judon on the other side of Jenkins wouldn't help the Jets pass rush. It definitely would. It's not an either/or situation. Ngakoue would be nice, but I don't it's very realistic that the Jets will be able to sign him. I don't think Fowler will cost less, either. He was expensive in terms of draft picks when he was traded a couple of years ago, and the Rams signed him last offseason to a one-year $12 million contract that was fully guaranteed. He's not gonna be cheap. I'd easily pay that or more for Judon. I wouldn't pay 1/3 of that for Fowler. Fowler was mostly potential and little production until this season when he had 11.5 sacks. Prior to that, he had had 4, 8 and 4 sacks. His production may be solely because of the Rams' system and who he had around him (Aaron Donald and Clay Matthews). He's totally the type to get a big contract and then coast like Trumaine Johnson. Then there's his off-field issues. One can do whatever one wants in the draft. IMO there is no "you don't" in the draft. Mac drafted safeties back-to-back and continually ignored needs and took the BPA DL. Other GMs focus on need more than BPA, or a balance of the two. Others reach for players at positions of need. That bites some of them, and some of them it works out just fine. IMO the one thing that doesn't work in the draft is to look at each draft like it's the same and have a hard and fast set of rules that one never deviates from. One should have principles and guidelines to guide one, but "rules" are meant to be broken. Sometimes it takes a gamble or out of the box thinking to achieve one's goals and/or greatness. For the last 11 drafts things have been out of balance overwhelmingly in favor of the defense. Our offensive talent is bottom of the NFL. If the Jets want to be competitive, they need to focus on the offense for at least this draft. If Douglas signs a couple of FA OL and drafts 2 and adds 2 WRs and a RB, the offense will be in pretty good shape assuming that Herndon returns healthy and doesn't get himself suspended again and continues to develop. Besides, I said they could draft a CB in a mid or lower round, and of course if a great CB drops and is too good to pass up, then they should take him. But with all the needs on the OL and at WR, not to mention RB, then the D can take a hike this draft. I imagine that Douglas will sign a CB or two in FA and an edge rusher. That's basically all the D needs. Then in 2021, aside from an elite young edge rusher, the only glaring need might be an LT if we don't get one in this draft. Douglas could even trade up next year to get that elite edge prospect, add a CB or two in the draft and add some OL depth. We normally agree, and even still, I don't think we're that far apart, but we do disagree somewhat.
A lot more college teams are playing it now, so one would think that there would be a greater supply of 3-4 OLB types. I guess there is somewhat, but still not in terms of quality. I don't remember those draft days, but will take your word for it. All I remember is the Jets never being in position to get one of the few that were great prospects. That's why they almost had to take Gholston. I remember salivating over the likes of getting Brooks Reed in the draft they were so scarce. That's sad.
They also had the linebacker that went to the Packers in the last offseason. Very good edge rusher, but I don't think they highly prioritize that position. They do however get amazing production from it. They are a blitz heavy team
3-4 / 4-3 in today's NFL isn't all that important. Majority of teams outside of the Seahawks don't run their base defense. Base defense formations are becoming irrelevant.
The proof of this is the term “tweener” has all but disappeared on scouting reports. It’s now the edge position and you can either rush the passer or can’t.
Preach it. I have a very similar copy/paste response to the annual "we should switch defensive fronts" thread I've been using for about 6 years.
I get that, but no matter what you run, you need to have the players who can play it. We've been a 3/4 team for a long time, but somehow our personnel people - GM, scouting - failed to find players who fit it. I hope Douglas can reverse the pattern.
No doubt, agreeing with you and just building on that convo ... nickel is the new base defense, just wait until everyone in the league has pass catching backs. Too bad the Jets still won't know what to do with it.
you find the best 11 players and you scheme around it. The franchise's ignorance for not drafting an outside rusher at least once every two years is their downfall. I get it, they love to stop the run and create a push inside, but you compliment that with speed on the outside and the Jets have neglected that.
What's weird is that team speed overall hasn't really been neglected. Darron Lee and Demario Davis were both inside linebackers that can fly. We went after Chris Johnson and Mike Vick as backups and while they usually sucked we always have had a David Clowney type of receiver on the bench that could get moving. Same thing with kick returners - Andre Roberts, Leon Washington, Justin Miller, etc. This organization has been absolutely terrified of drafting the fast edge rusher. We haven't even tried since Lorenzo Mauldon in 2015. Jordan Jenkins doesn't count because he was never going to be that type of player. Vernon Gholston has truly damaged this franchise.
Yeah primarily talking about addressing the outside pass rush. Gholston did break this team which is pathetic. They don't know what to look for.
Not sure it was gholston or Rex’s preference of 275-285 lb Suggs type olbs with more power than speed.
Rex preferred bigger and more powerful linebackers over speed. Gholston, he had a unique blend of both I think? Overall I think the Jets prefer a balanced linebacker and would even sacrifice good pass rush talent as long as they can set the edge and stop the run.
not sure if this is serious question or defense only question because it seems so weird I think Curtis Martin was a decent player They can be had
I’ll throw another name out there who May come cheaper but is an all around OLB, Markus Golden. Good pash rusher who is good setting the edge, 3 down LB who may fit in well here.
