I think he gave the draft a C due to the very questionable later round picks. And I don't think he is saying that the FO had Clemens rated higher, just that he was better for our team in the larger picture, because we were able to get him in the second round instead of having to use our #4. I disagree that there are two kinds of posters on here. I think many, including myself, orginally would have liked Bush or Leinart, but realize that there is reason and logic behind what the FO did as well. We also realize that what's done is done and that there is no use in complaining about it, but instead should hope that the players pan out for the good of the team.
how do you know some of the picks we had were reaches...according to who, mel kiper??? maybe the next team after us was about to take eric smith....you don't know.....if you don't like a certain player we drafted, fine, but have you seen every team's draft boards, and if so, where can i possibly see them?
Let me clarify. I thought the 4 best players with the most upside in this draft based on talent and raw ability where Bush, Williams, Young and Davis in that order. When Houston decided to take Williams 1 it was clear that 3 of those 4 players where going to be gone. Now between Davis, Leinart and D'Brick you really only have two choices, D'Brick or Davis because Leinart while a QB doesn't have any where near the talent projection at the NFL level that these two have. While Davis is the bigger talent LT is the more important position. I would have preferred Davis because I believe Jones will be a good LT but if the new staff doesn't believe in Jones and they believe in D'Brick they absolutely made the right choice and by not second guessing it I'm not sucking up to them, I'm respecting the fact that they may know what they are doing and frankly while I like Jones he didn't do enough last year to fully sell me on him. Now as far as Leinart playing like Carson Palmer in 3 years. Science will have to come a long way because unless Leinart gets bionic arms and legs he doesn't have prayer of being the talent Palmer was before he was hurt. There isn't another QB in the NFL with Carson Palmers potential. Carson Palmer would have been the No. 1 player on every NFL team’s board this year. I believe the Jets think Clemens has a better arm and quicker release than Leinart and so do I. My biggest fear in this draft was taking Matt Leinart over Mario Williams, D'Brick or Vernon Davis. I rated the draft a C because how does anyone know how any draft will turn out? Rating the draft now is pretty much a waste. They get an A for effort and an incomplete until the end of the season.
Have to say that I really really disagree with you. And not from a "homer" point of view. On the draft coverage today, it was widely stated that they got tremendous value with their picks on the second day. Brad Smith was expected to go almost exactly where he did and could become a tremendous slash type competitor. Washington was considered going into this year one of the top RB prospects in all of college football. He was in a horrible football situation without any type of offensive line and dropped off a bit. He could be an incredible steal in the draft. In terms of day one, see below
Let me give you a few examples. Jeff Lageman was taken by the Jets in the first round most likley if we had taken him he would have gone in the 4th round. We may think he is a great player but its a waste to take him with the first pick. If we liked him so much use a 2nd or 3rd on him. It really does not matter if he tirned out to be a bust or the next Jack Lambert. What I am arguing about is getting the best value for each pick and not paying for a 4th round commidity with a 1st round pick. Lets say we like Tom Brady and we know he is about a 6th round talent. It would be a waste to use a 1st round pick if we can get him in the 4th, 5th or sixth round. My idea of value is maximizing value from your pick by not taking players we overvalue early. For example lets say we like E. Smith or Shlegal why throw away a third round pick on them. Take them in the 5th-7th round. When you look at good drafting teams they don't reach up but they wait for good players to they want to drop to them. They reliaze they cannot have everyone want but if they wait for someone to drop they can get a good player every pick. BTW, I agree with you about Gabe Watson. The idea of getting good value for your picks does not mean you have to take players you don't want that drop. Rather it means you have a number of players you like and your flexible enough to take one of those at each pick when they drop. Thats the difference rather than locking onot players you have to take early to get. You lock onto a number of players you like and your patient enough to wait for one to drop. Thats how you maximize your draft value and you build a team. Now that does mean you can't jump up and take a player you really like. Of course you can. Rather it means you don't reach and take a player early every round. There are really two points here. Do you believe the Jets FO knows something all the experts do not. They were the one team that deviated from the experts and that consisently drafted people far out of position. If you believe the jets know something the rest of the league and the experts doesn't well then more power to you. But if you recognize the probablilty of the Jets FO being right and everyone else being so far off on so many picks is almost zero then you realize that we picked many players far out of position. In otehr words we then wasted the value and potential of many of our picks by taking a number of players many rounds early. The point isn't whether the players are any good but that we didn't use our picks appropiately. When you look at the good drafting teams they do not reach to take picks. They almost always pick along with the experts and have the patience to get players that drop and the patience to lsoe players that do not drop.
In my opinion, the Jets got most of the players that they targeted and have something to build the team around. Getting D'Brick at # 4 will help our team play well for a long time. Having an extra second rounder next year gives us an opportunity to fill a hole we may have missed this time around. The problem that I had with the draft is the missed opportunities. We passed up players that were not expected to fall as far as they did to take the players that our FO expected to be there. Jimmy Williams, Winston Justice, Leonard Pope, Max-Gene Gilles, Eric Winston, the list goes on and on. Rather than taking the best available player with each pick and waiting for the holes to fill themselves, it appears that specific players (that WOULD BE THERE) were targeted to fill needs for their leadership / character. Rather than trading down each time the FO knew it would reach it would have been nice to see them adapt their plan to take advantage of the opportunity to add more talent to the team than anticipated. We have a young GM / HC combination. I hope they learned something from the Eagles that will help them to do better next year. That being said, Kellen Clemens has the opportunity to make them look alot smarter than they were this year. I hope our newest players will prove me wrong.
Buttle you make a strong argument and it's logical however at the end of the day in order to evaluate based on your criteria the Jets would have to not only rate the players for them, they would have to speculate how every one else rated the same players. In a limited amount of time, that's an awful lot to ask of these guys in their first draft.
We traded down three times and move up as well. Speculating on how other teams rate players is part and parcel of running the draft for an NFL team. First time or not they just don't get a pass there.
Who's giving them a pass? Guys here last year though the Jolley trade was spectacular because we got Justin Miller at the bottom of round 2 and would have drafted him in round 1 if we had the pick. Now that would have been stupid since there were CB every bit as good as Justin Miller who went right through the middle of round 3 last year. I don't doubt we made some mistakes where we didn't make a mistake was in our first 3 picks they were spot on. The problem is your quibbeling in the back half of the draft. You also conviently leave out the fact that we picked up a 1st day pick next year.
That is a big part of the draft. Not just rating players but guessing when they will go. Its a game where you need to know more than who may be a good football player but how to economically maximize the use of your picks. To play the game best and get the most from your picks you need to both aspects well. The scouting and drafting serviuces that every teams subcribe do a pretty darn good job of predicting when players will go. But nothing is static as every players value is in constant motion up or down. Thats what makes the draft such a beautifull thing.
I don't disagree I just believe we had a great 1st day value draft we came out with 3 potential starters at 3 major positions, we also picked up a 1st day pick next year which has a lot of value. If the staff falls in love with one or two guys that goes against the consensus board, whatever that is, so what. We didn't trade picks to get a player like D'Rob, we didn't pick Thomas over Ed Reed we didn't move our 1st round pick for a 3rd string TE and a second and a 6th. We made some later picks that may have been a reach because our staff liked them and in the process got a nice 1st day pick next year.
i would like to know how you got access to all 32 nfl teams' draft boards??? it seems like your basing your opinion of draft grades from the same "experts" that had gabe watson, ko simpson, darnell bing, max jean-gilles, and countless others going in the late 1st/early second rounds.....
Didn't leave that out at all: "Having an extra second rounder next year gives us an opportunity to fill a hole we may have missed this time around." Pick 1 was solid, no question there. Pick 2 was pretty good but Winston Justice or Jimmy Williams could have been taken. Pick 3 could be very good but is definitely risky With 10 picks, the last 7 were more than 2/3 of the draft. The value of those picks has a huge impact on our franchise.
Our FO got the guys they wanted. Our team will be better for it. We didn't make any huge mistakes. However, the missed opportunities will not help us get to the SB.
Didn't both Justice and Williams go in the second round? How could you possible suggest they were 1st round value if they went in the second round in both cases after our 2nd round pick? Are you seriously suggesting that we shouldn't have taken our targeted Franchise QB in the second round and should have taken Justice or Williams ahead of the best rated Center in the draft and the best QB on the board who we need and wanted?
I agree and disagree. The D'Brick and Mangold picks were pretty easy. I am glad they didn't do anything silly with them. After that I don't have much good to say although I am excited about Clemens. I will also agree with you its betetr to throw away 7 picks between round 3 and 10 than to mess up a first round pick. But, I like the Thomas pick over Reed more than the picks we made in the third round yesterday. At least Thomas had value and was not as much of a reach. I don't know if you recall these boards when Thomas was picked. People here loved Thomas. There was post after post calling Thomas the greatest player we had ever drafted. I can't tell you how many threads there were saying Thomas would be better then Julius Peppers and how foolish the panthers were to take Peppers with the second pick. Well, I found it quite sickening. One of the reasons it took me 4 years before I ever posted on this board. But thats besides the point. Regardless I hope I am shown to be very wrong and that all our picks work out and help us build a better team.
Are you serious? From what I remember, Jets fans (myself included) were really pissed about that pick. Alot of people were praying for Ed Reed, but instead Bradway decided to pick a crappy DE in the first round to backup our 2 other 1st round DEs.
They won't all work out no draft is perfect but we have something to look forward to and maybe we have the next great Jets QB. If we do than this will be the best draft since 65. .:beer:
There was some talk on these boards about Reed but after the pre-season it all went away and Thomas was annointed as the savior of the franchise. That pre-season we went undefeated and Thomas had a good pre-season. Unfortunately that was about the last of Brian we saw for a couple of years.
If Clemens works out it will be remembered as a great draft. Either way its done and we should be excited to see whats ahead.
