He did help us win but we more won in spite of him against KC and we should have another win or 2. Favre has a MUCH more talneted team, he is throwing to Coles & Cotchery while Chad is throwing to Ted Ginn, jr. If you think favre is playing better than Chad I can't help you, you just look at fantasy #s and not the real value of the QB. The only thing Favre is doing worse is turning it over? That's it? he only has 13 TOs in 7 games, he's only averaging almost 2 a game but that's a small thing I guess. Last year has nothing to do w/ this year. We had no OL and no running game 2 areas which we do have this year. Fluky type injuries, he wasn't hurt from taking a constant pounding like Favre has taken. I obviously like Chad and I actually like Favre too but I am HONEST. You back it up w/ meaningless fantasy #s. Your big argument was Mimai's scoring last year when they were 0-7 and scored most of their points in garbage time in big losses. You think Favre played well at SD b/c he had a good rating and threw some TDs. he had a 92 rating he must have had a good game? meanwhile he led us to 1 TD "drive"( a 4 yd drive set up by a Leon KR) through 3 qtrs and was part of a 4 consecutive possession stretch where we turned it over each time. More useful insight I like you kokes, you are a good poster so far.
That is completely not true?!? Meaningless Fantasy numbers?? I backed it up with the following: Thrown TD's <---- Sure, meaningful in fantasy Total offensive TD's <---- Not meaningfull for rushing TD's, unless ur QB Total Points <---- Again, Favre gets no fantasy points for FG's. Wins <---- Again, not a meaningful fantasy stat TO's <---- Meaningful fanstasy stat THAT IS IN CHADS FAVOR. How you see my argument as only see "garbage" fantasy stats just isn't supportable. How am i skewing anything? It's that you take all this and looks at only TO's. The only thing I have a problem with is you in spite of these things saying that Favre = Horrible, Penny = Really good. If you TRULY believe Favre is playing terrible/mediocre, then there is no way to justify Penny being GREAT this year. The numbers simply aren't there. And all this stuff about throwing out "garbage" points is somewhat valid. But even if you throw out his garbage 2TD'sin SD game, its still 13 to 7. I'm sure that Houston wishes the NFL was as strict as you about "garbage" points, cause if so then all those late 4th qtr points INDI put up could be taken away. And I have no problem with you. But please if you want to say that Penny is playing great, thats fine. Just realize then that Favre is playing fine too!
junc...on behalf of all of us....if you really like Pennington that much, then please just become a Miami fan now and stop talking about how Pennington would have been good on the jets this year and how you think he is better than Favre. We all know that once we got Favre we were better off. Just please I don't want to hear anymore of this nonsense. That goes for all you Pennington is better than Favre lovers too. Go becom a Miami fan, we don't want to here your bs.
Your argument is spurious at best. Let's do this. Take away Favre's one amazing game and he's thrown for 9 touchdowns and 10 interceptions. Now compare those numbers to Pennington. To say Favre has been better than Pennington this year is not accurate. To this point Pennington is having the much better season. Favre looked great in one game, okay in three, and sucked in three. That's hardly anything about which to gloat. Even with that one game Pennnington has the higher completion percentage, significantly more yards per attempt, and a higher QB rating. I'm not going to get into the whole Pennington vs. Favre thing as it's mute at this point. Suffice it to say Brett better get better or the Jets are going nowhere.
I concure that Favre looked great in one game, ok to good in 3, and flat lousy in 3, but the bold statement I take issue with. Comp% and yds/cmps are not as important as offensive TD's and wins. My whole argument is that Pennington has not been having a "great" year. Penny has been a competent manager this year, but nothing special. Penny has lead his team to a total of 17 TD's in 7 games. Using ur logic to take out great game, I'll remove the 6 TD NE game from his resume. Now Penny has lead his team to 11 TD's in 6 games. Thats less than 2 TD/game. This is a great year? By this definition then, almost every QB would be having a great year. A QB's job is to either score points, or win games. I can see the logic in either argument. Its just silly to think that leading ur team to the 22nd ranked Offense in the league and a 3-4 record is "great".
You point to his TDs, that's fantasy #s, the #s are heavily skewed by 1 game. Chad has made his team better, Favre has held his team back and I don't care what the individual #s say. I never said Chad was playing great but he's playing very well and badly outplaying Favre. How in the World can you say Favre is playing fine when he is clearly holding this offense back? He has been awful for 3 straight weeks after his one great game and he has allowed bad teams to hang around and one of them beat us b/c of that. 100%. I am always honest unlike many around here and I will always defend the truth and not the rumors created on this board and in other places. I don't fall prey to media hype like most people do which is why I never wanted the overrated Favre to begin w/. W/ all that written I LIKE Fvare and badly want him to succeed b/c it helps my team. NO Jet fan wants to win more than I do(many want them to win as much but none more). I don't fall prey to the false notions of how bad Herm was when the facts tell a different story, I don't fall prey to the false notions of how bad Chad was when the facts tell us differently and I donm't fall prey to false notions about Favre when the facts tell us differently. Who is all of us? Seriously, who are you? I get bashed for using that line many times but people show up out of nowhere and act like they have been here 5 years. If "we" all knew that once we got Favre we were better off then how come that has happened YET? I hope it happens but so far it happens so how did you KNOW something that hasn't happened? what were the 3 games he looked ok to good? Miami- ok, good for his 1st start NE- bad SD- bad Ari- great Cincy- bad Oak- terrible KC- absolutely dreadful Fvare hasn't been leading us to alot of points. He had the 50 against Ari which obviously was great outside of that game he is leading us to an average of 20 PPG against D's that on average give up 24 PPG. Chad has led his O to 21 PPG against D's that on average give up 22 PPG and AGAIN has done so w/MUCH less talent to work w/.
You're honest and defend the truth others are liars or rumor mongerers. Interesting take on arguments that are all based on individual opinion and rarely to if ever based on facts. You are either paranoid or simple don't respect that people can see the same thing and have a difference of opinion neither of which is fact based. I hate to say this but when a person needs to defend their honesty when arguing opinions its pretty much an acknowledgement that they lost the argument or know they are being dishonest.
I don't necessarily think others are liars I just think they see things on TV or get incorrect info and it spreads. They believe the hype they see and hear about, I have the ability to see beyond that. I respect a difference of opinion, I don't respect when people throw things out there and don't have anything to back it up w/. It does bother me when perceptions get out of control and we see things floated out as fact that are not fact such as Herm sucked and Chad sucked. You can say you weren't fans of their styles but you cannot see they weren't good for us b/c the facts show that they were. It's soty of like saying the late '60s Raiders were great when they never won a Championships but the dynasty Pats who won 3 Championships in 4 years were not.
When I say the late 60's Raiders were great that is my opinion based on seeing them over and over again and comparing their play to my 40 plus years of experience watching pro football. Your opinion on that is based on a throw away line based on not seeing them play one game. My opinion isn't any more valuable than yours it's my opinion. Just like it's my opinion that the Jets teams that Herm coached should have gone further than Herm took them and that Penny while an excellent QB for 1 year turned out to be fragile and while servicable isn't that good. You simply don't understand what a fact is which is why your opinions aren't taken as seriously as you would like them to be. What you are really telling people is their opinions aren't as valuable as yours because yours are fact based. People simply don't like to be told that they are liars based on your BS.
I don't disagree that oak was a big time team but there's no way they were better than a team that won 3 SBs in 4 years w/ the lone year they didn't win b/c we beat them out. My opinions should be taken seriously b/c I know what I am talking about. I don't throw out nonsense and hope it sticks like many people on here do. It's a fact the Jets had to win just 1 home game to get to a SB, that's easier than having to win 2-3 and the fact that they had a worse record than Oak and still had the home game helped them even more. If that game is in oak we likely don't have SB III to fall back on. Obviously again you don't have the facts to back up your points so you have to attack me. It's what you always do. I stick to the argument at hand and you start deflecting to points that have nothing to do w/ the topic.
You're still skewing the numbers in your favor?!?! You would make a WONDERFUL politician. Why in the world does it make sense to take out the Jets best offensive production day without removing the Fins best day? Oh I know, because thats the only way to show the Fins have a stronger offensive production. Jets w/o AZ game: (26.0pts/game*7 - 56)/6 = 21 pts/game Fins w/o NE game: (20.7pts/game*7 - 38)/6 = 17.8 pts/game The way you argue and unfairly remove from one side of the argument would make Bellicheat proud.
Yep. Herm sucked which is why we were better after Herm toolk mover than before. Chad sucked which is why Chad is the ONLY Jets QB to start in 3 postseasons for us and he's playing very well now that he's healthy again. What is amazing is that w/ a horrible HC and horrible QB how we actually won so many games? yeah I never provide facts unlike you who tell us how great Oak was even though they never won a Championship but ignore the facts that our 2002 team interrupted a DYNASTY. You bore me winston, you used to be a good poster and you still can be but you are too caught up in trying to attack me than you are w/ posting good information.
WHY? B/c Chad has had other really good games, the ARI game was Brett's ONLY good game of the season! Brett is also getting credit for defensive TDs? Our O scored 50 against Ari and 22 against SD. The O w/o the Ari game is averaging 19.8 PPG. Miami's O is averiing 17.8. 2 less PPG and that includes the garbage time points we scored in SD so in essence our O's are very similar PPG wise yet Chad has half the talent we have and the only talen he does have are his RBs who are having a WORSE season than our RBs.
While it wont make much of a difference to take away chads best game, as he has had ZERO "amazing games"... if you throw out Miami's best game overall: a 6TD performance against NE, Suddenly while favre's numbers start to resemble Peyton Mannings this season, Miami's numbers begin to look absolutely putrid overall. They would have BARELY over 10 total TD's on the year. My point is, you can't just throw out a game in comparing QB's, because the game actually happened, and Favre really did have one of his better performances of his career. The one thing I will say is: I almost despise that performance, because it made everything just "expect" that to be the type of offense we will get all year. Maybe if Shotty would stop changing the offense week to week, and just develope consistency and as Favre said "those 2-3 plays that you can rely on" in tough spots... and maybe, just maybe, the jets would be alright. Lets put it this way: Favre is Favre. He throws a lot of interceptions. ALways has. Wouldn't surprise me to seem him at the 18int mark on the season. However, he may also have 30 TD passes, which again would be a probowl like season assuming the jets get into the playoffs. Favre is who he is, and his best seasons come with the Coach's not just cater to Favre, but when Favre does start getting wild... calling plays in which easy first down completions are made (the bread and butter plays) to get Favre settled back down. That was a mistake MM made in Dallas: Favre threw two deep ints, and he goes ahead nad calls another deep pass. You need to know the situation, and it's that Favre feels right now he needs to air it out. It was time to turn to the slant plays... but that didn't happen till AR came in. Favre is held accountable for his mistakes, he always has been, and he knows he can't keep doing them. But, from what I got out of his last press conference - those 2 - 3 comfort zone passes are not really there, so it's really hard for this coaching staff to get Favre settled down when he starts taking too many shots. So, while yes Favre is at fault for the turnovers, coaching has so much to do with it it's not funny. Favre plays at his best when the coaching staff is at it's best.
This proves your argument how? In '02 we lost to the AFC Champs, in '04 we lost to a 15-1 team who then lost to a dynasty team. It's not like we lost to bad teams. The facts are we got BETTER after Herm took over. Herm made the postseason here w'/ 2 different QBs and the team re-tooled 2 more times so he made it w/ 3 very different teams. Awful HC's cannot do that. I have no problem w/ people not liking him but be fair w/ him. He was a GOOD coach for us, not great but good. Chad reached 3 different postseasons and is the ONLY Jets QB to ever win a playoff game in 2 different postseason and start in 3 different postseasons and he's only the 2nd Jets QB EVER to win a road playoff game. If people dislike Chad b/c of their frustrations w/ his durability that's fine but that doesn't change the FACT that he was and still is a good QB.
