Since Vilma is gone and now Manginis full 3-4 scheme is coming into the picture i was just thinking about something after i just saw a video of the last year with herm. When there is a 4-3 defense there is that MLB who vilma was who is THAT LEADER like he is the middle of the whole scheme...he calls the signals he does everything and everyone feeds off him in the 3-4, it may be more "productive" or whatnot but it seems to me that when you run a 3-4 you don't have that one player who the whole defense feeds off of When vilma first started and he intercepted the ball in that 49ers game the whole defense for the second half of that season was remarkable...it seems like they fed off him...his energy and everything i just feel like even though harris is our man in the middle now his presence is not felt as great because there isn't that one guy i just want to you what you all think thanks
When ANYONE on a team's defense makes a big play, the momentum swings and the defensive players play a little bit harder. Kerry Rhodes, David Harris, Calvin Pace, and Shaun Ellis should be great leaders this year for the Jets' defense. Vilma was a non-factor in the 3-4.
Just because there is actually no guy in the direct middle, doesn't mean that there won't be a leader. That defense will feed off of whoever is guy who rarely misses his assignment and is an impact. I wouldn't be surprised to see Jenkins be that guy this year.
I see no problem there at all. Harris has stepped into Vilma' shoes without missing a beat. Leaders on D are two tier the front 7 and secondary, and for the latter, Rhodes does that well. Just going though last years TC pics................ Leader.
I think it's more about the player than the position. The Pats run a 3-4 but their leader seems to be Harrison. The Chargers run a 3-4 but their big play guy is an OLB. There are some great 4-3 Mike backers like Ray Lewis and Pierce on the Giants, but it is more personality than position.
Vilma is a finese player, Harris is a nasty killer. Give me a nasty defense over a finese defense every day.
I think you have to distinguish in this case. The Defense will feed of every big play or hard tackle, whoever makes a play. Every Sack or TFL will get the Defense going. The other thing is leadership. The team has to accept a player as a leader. Making the calls,being responsable for what happens are all part of the leadership. But I think the most important attitude for a leader is to play hard on every snap. I think Harris, Rhodes, Jenkins and maybe even Pace could step up and be leaders.
they say the 4-3 is a player's D and the 3-4 is a coach's D - so Mangini should be the guy they feed off of.
We aren't a strictly 3-4 team, we will still show 4-3 fronts at times, and honestly I do believe that the defense does feed off our defensive leaders energy primarily Kerry Rhodes and David Harris.
I think you're right, but I also think that now we have a primarily 3-4 D personell those kind of hybrid Ds will be used less.
It is more of a coach's D, but Vilma just wasn't that good in a 3-4. In a season and a half, he was merely average at best.
I think you're point is a liiiiiiiiittle dumb. Like...just a little. Not a lot. Just a little. Like.... this fucking much.
Half the fun in a 3-4 is the fact that you can use any front you want. Why would they change that? The scheme's whole reason of existence is because it's theoretically better (at least more fun) than any other D when it comes to hiding blitzes and coverages. Why would we get such versatile players and keep only one front?
I think it will be the same as we've seen, just more effective. Mangini isn't just seeking players that can play 3-4, he's seeking players that can play multiple schemes as they are required. Vilma and Robertson could only play in 4-3 roles and their production fell off when we switched to other schemes.
Look at the Ravens all those years they were one of the most succesfull teams playing in the 3-4 Defense and Ray Lewis was the "Leader" and they definately fed off of him and I Think Ray in his prime could be that leader at Middle Linebacker in a 3-4 Like he did or a 4-3 but Vilma who was great in the couple seasons in the 4-3 but his production in the 3-4 like everyone of us know just wasent good and Harris came in and outshined him hands down so dont take anything away from Harris because in my opinion he is our "Leader" of our 3-4 Defense. Vilma bitched about the system from day one so who knows maybe he never wanted to really learn it but who cares now Harris will be our leader no doubt in my mind. I CANT WAIT FOR THE SEASON TOO START!
Yes, Lewis was the leader of that defense. Just remember, though, that the 2000 Super Bowl team had a 4-3 defense. Left to right, the line was Rob Burnett, Sam Adams, Tony Siragusa, and Michael McCrary. The linebackers were Peter Boulware, Lewis, and Jamie Sharper. Other leaders in 3-4 defensive schemes include: Chris Spielman, Lions, 1988-94 Reggie Williams, Bengals, 1980-89 Steve Nelson, Patriots, late 70s/early 80s Sam Mills, Saints, 1986-94 Harry Carson, Giants, 1979-88 Matt Millen, Raiders, 1980s Hardy Nickerson, Levon Kirkland, and Greg Lloyd were all leaders of the Steelers defense in various years in the late 1980s and 1990s.
it's true that Harris isn't the same type of outspoken leader Vilma was. Harris is more soft-spoken. Last year there were several times when MAngini and Barton said that Harris had to deepen his voice in the huddle....which is pretty embarrassing. But he is a better fit for the defense, and leads better through his play and there are others on the defense that are vocal intnse leaders. Rhodes, Ellis, Jenkins, Barton...
Maybe not by Giants fans, but Crason was very underrated. All the focus was on LT and whilst LT dominated, there was a very good leader behind that D. I see Harris as very much the same, in terms of stature and nature. (Off topic) I met Matt Millen in london a few years back and was very surprised by his character. He hadn't long finished playing with the Raiders. Really nice approachable fella.
How have you been able to 'observe' the defense feeding off of Vilma in 2004 and not feeding off anyone since we switched to a 3-4 lol I don't grasp this concept.
