I think that everyone agrees that this is perhaps if not the biggest need, the second biggest need for this team. The question is where do we find a NT. The three guys in free agency that project as 3-4 NTs are Albert Haynesworth, Ethan Kelly, and Issac Sopoaga (as far as I know, there may be more that I don't know about). I'm not sure if Haynesworth is going to be looked at by the FO and there is some concern that he is only playing great this year for a contract. Sopoaga is the starting NT out in San Fran, he's got the size to play the position, but I really don't see great things from him. Kelly is the backup right now with the Browns. He seems like he has potential, but he isn't an established player yet. There is also a lot of debate as to whether there is a 3-4 NT in the draft. Is Frank Okam a NT at the next level? It doesn't seem like there is a Wilfork or Ngata in this draft. So again where do we find a NT that can be an impact player for the future. It seems right now that there are a lot of stop gap solutions, but nothing long term. Thoughts?
Bj Raji ( if he declares), Frank Morton, Red Bryant, and Jason Shirley (character concerns) are really the only possibilities at 3-4 NT. I hate Okam, these are the type of guys that do nothing on the next level. Great size for the next level but the work ethic and desire is just not there. He wouldn't be a NT in the 3-4 anyway. Plays way too tall with no leverage. Edit: I'd love Albert Haynesworth, but like Okam he'd be a DE in our system.
another missed foresight by our front office.... a move to the 3-4 with nothing in the middle in sight. adapt, move to some defense that fits our personel for gods sake.
Well there's nothing we can do about the past, the FO has definitely made mistakes, but they have also done things that looked like bad moves to some of our fans, but turned out to be great (see trading up for Darelle Revis and David Harris). Right now this team needs that nasty NT. If we can get that guy then D-Rob can move to end, Vilma can be protected, and this defense can go to a new level.
Isn't Kelly the backup behind Ted Washington? It'd be foolish of them to let him go next year if that's the case.
Raji is a good answer if he declares-- I am a fan I would be stoked if we got him..Red Bryant wouldn't be bad either
The move to the 3-4 was a bad move. We had too many highly talented defenders who were ideal fits in a 4-3 and did NOT fit in a 3-4. The nose position is what makes the 3-4 tick..and b/c there are too many other teams running the D, and b/c no college teams RUN a 3-4...Nose's are few and far between. A move back to the 4-3 seems inevitible.
I've been slowly coming around to the same conclusion myself, for the reasons you give. I'd add to that, I don't think any of our new players since the switch wouldn't fit into a 4-3.
I don't agree with your analysis on Haynesworth. Fact of the matter is, he's one of the stronger, more athletic guys at the position in the NFL. I don't think anyone's going to overwhelm him at the point of attack. I think he's the kind of guy who allows you to mix it up. There are cheaper, more character friendly options, but none of them really has the potential to be a major upgrade that Haynesworth has. Sopoaga would be one. Here's a list... Isaac Sopoaga Ted Washington(for a couple of downs) Ethan Kelly Cornelius Griffin- stout run-stuffer who is likely to be released because he makes 6.2 mill next year Randy Starks None of these guys are going to solve our problems, but they'd be an upgrade in depth with some upside. That's about what's out there. -X-
i guess this way of thinking lets our troops stay in a quagmire in iraq? i guess we can continue using this defense to ill effect, while a continuance on losing takes place.....yep that will turn our team around.
I am not suggesting that the Jets have the right personnel for the 3-4, but the coach thought it is the better system for the long-term and made the switch. I really don't think that you can look at the team that finished the 2005 season and find many "highly talented defenders" suited for the 4-3 outside of Vilma. Ellis - can play end well in either system Abe - on his way out either way Robertson - maybe, but he took a step back in 2005 w/out Ferguson Barton - probably better suited for the 4-3, but it is not like he was a beast at LB in that system either Hobson - average in both systems My take is that the Jets didn't have a steller defense in the 4-3 system (despite what Junc constantly chirps about..."the Jets were 1 year removed from a top 5 defense"). So, Mangini can either go with a system he is uncomforable giving mediocre production or change to what he believes is the superior system and start building towards the future. I am not saying the move to the 3-4 has been successful, but I don't necessarily crucify Mangini for making the switch either.
If you look at the personnel, then yes it was completely moronic to make such a move. But if the Jets FO was so dedicated to keeping the 4-3 intact, then hiring Mangini was the poor choice, I dont think he can run the 4-3, otherwise we would have went that road to begin with...
Lets clear something up here, Victor Hobson is not even close to an average LB in any system. He's a undersized backup LB in any system. Plain and simple!
new england does not run a strict 3-4 defense. niether should mangini since most of his experience was watching belichick from the back of the film room. maybe his dumb butt went to sleep on the days it got too complicated for him. anyway, in the red zone you'll see this hybrid 3-4 morph in to a multitude of defenses, with no fear of being beaten deep, hence the bend and dont break philosophy. the OTHER big difference is on most plays the big dudes up front can hold up the run long enough for the lb's to recover and pursue. their lb's have major recognition skill and play exceptional as a unit. these are attributes mangini has not brought to the jets table and we are close to finishing year 2 of his regime. we cant shut down the run with our entire front 7 in the 3-4, so why not switch to the 4-3 which suits our personel?
i don't see where a return to the 4-3 is inevitible......unless you have talked directly with mangini, b/c he seems intent on staying with the 3-4 right up to the present.... as far as finding our nt, just go to walmart!!!! most folks here seem to think we need to find that 340 lb nasty individual to play it. as if just weighing a ton makes the person a nose tackle... well, as i said, i have seen plenty of them at your local walmart. 340 lbs or better of manly looking,nasty,ugly WOMEN.... lol
