Undersized Nose Tackle , Vilma is best suited to be a 4-3 Middle Linebacker , Hobson, Barton, Coleman and Ellis would be riding the pine on Most NFL teams.
Ellis Wears down too quickly, due to D rob's size, he's only effective 50% of the time, Vilma is better suited for a 4-3 and Hobson is more of a situational 4-3 player.
At this point, it really looks to be the schemes and coaching, and Sutton getting outwitted by opposing OCs. You cant fire all eleven starters- change the scheme or the DC.
It's DRob, Vilma, Ellis playing the 3-4. Since that's the HC decision, then you could say that it is Mangini. He said the 3-4 it more versatile than the 4-3 but obviously not versatile enough with the personnel we got. And why isn't Bowens starting in place of Hobson. That's another Mangini's decision.
I was a vocal supporter when Ellis got his extension, but I have to say he is not playing up to his contract. He is making the type of money a lineman makes when he not only plays up to an elite level, but makes the players around him look good, raising the level of his unit. Ellis can't really even make himself look good, and he was drafted as a 3-4 lineman by Parcells.
IT'S NOT THE SCHEME, IT'S NOT THE COACHING. IT'S THE PLAYERS ACTING LIKE BEYOTCHES AND NOT TACKLING. THE PLAYERS ARE IN POSITION TO MAKE PLAYS AND ARE NOT. JUST REFUSE TO PUT A HAT ON SOMEONE. "SIDE TACKLING" "You don't wanna get in there, you don't wanna tackle. You're soft" , AS QUOTED BY THE LATE GREAT FRANK ANTONACCI. Ok I'm done.
Everything about the defense controls everything else. ALA, the players aren't executing at 100%. There have been flashes of how good our defense can be, but they are just starting slow this season.
It really comes down to the NT. A 3-4 defense without a nose tackle is no defense at all and that's what the Jets have right now. The whole point of the 3-4 is to tie up offensive linemen on the line of scrimmage freeing up quicker and more flexible linebackers to make plays. The linebackers have a better view of the situation because they're not down in a 3 point stance and so they are supposed to be able to react quicker. It's a run prevent defense and always has been. The problem is that if the linemen can't tie up the offensive line at the point of attack then all the flexibility that a linebacker has to read and react goes away because he has a 300 lb hog on his ass tying him down. Without an effective NT none of the defensive line's assignments are going to be handled particularly well and the run defense breaks down. That's where we are now. Why is D-Rob still playing at NT when the Jet's defense has been so bad against the run since they went to the 3-4? That's the question.
No surge off the snap. None. Our entire front is pushed back a yard, and that pushes our LB's off 4 yards. This is how every down starts. We need a bigger dudes.
i do not expect a 3 man line to stop the OL surge. The OL could be blocking with 5,6 or even 7. I think it is on the LBs. Maybe I am crazy but our LBs looked lost in space. They never make plays in the backfield and they never defense a pass. I say the fault primarily lies with them. Oh, and they are rotten blitzers too. Yes we won today. We beat a bad team by 3 points. The way Miami went up and down the field late made me nauseous. I have been trying to keep an open mind but frankly, today's game worried me. I thought there was reason to be optimistic, but I don't know now.
When your 1st Rd, ILB, Defensive Captain, has a stat line of 4 tackles and 1 assist, you need not look further. He looks smaller and smaller and like less of a factor every game. When he does get his tackles they're all 8 yards upfield and never at the point of attack. Who remembers the last time he made a stop on 3rd and short? The last great game he had was in the playoff loss against Pittsburgh his rookie year. That looked like his coming out party. He fooled us. When you hitch your wagon to a slightly better than average ILB don't expect a defense that's gonna win games.
I think it is the undersized LB's. David harris is good. BT is pretty good, but can't cover anyone. Vilma, Barton and Hobson can't take on blockers.
Which of the defensive linemen can absorb a doubleteam without getting pushed to the side or 3 yards into the backfield? The linebackers only become the major issue if the defensive line is holding up its end and we're still having problems.
With the Jets defense, it all boils down to the defensive line. With the 3-4 defense, as BSux mentioned, the defensive lineman make or break the entire defense. The whole point is for the lineman to tie up lineman so that the linebackers can make plays. You want a perfect example? Look at the Ravens defense. When they play 3-4, they have not only play-making LB's that can wreak havoc when not blocked and when they are blocked can get out of them, but they also have 340 pound NT and two 320+ pound DE's. That makes it impossible for lineman to get to the linebackers, allowing said linebackers to absolutely destroy the run game. It's the pass game where if your linebackers can't cover then you have an issue. The Jets don't have big bullrushing lineman. They don't have large linebackers besides Thomas, and he can't cover anybody. To get any pressure today they had to rush 8. Their secondary with Rhodes and Revis is the only bright spot on the defense. Vilma is a monster in the 4-3 because he can go sideline to sideline without getting tied up. He is not a 3-4 lineman. Sean Ellis is an inside D lineman in a 4-3 defense, and you can still get guys like Bryan Thomas up, but sometimes down in a 3-point stance. If Mangini refuses to throw out the 3-4 until we're better suited for it, then we at least have to run a hybrid type thing where there's 3, 4, 5, even 6 guys down at times but you're always finding ways to free up the linebackers. If we don't do that, we're doomed this year and next year our number one priority is nose tackle, followed by LG.
I think it's a combination of a lack of quality in our front 7 coupled with a defensive philosophy of bend don't break. I don't buy into the 4/3 we don't have good lineman to play a 4/3 or a 3/4. What I don't like is we have a philosophy of bend don't break which by it's very nature lacks an attacking aggresive we can beat you mentality. Not only do we lack players on the front 7 we have told the players we have that they shouldn't attack the O they should keep everything in front of them. The best defenses not only have talent and scheme they are aggressive, tough and have an attitude that they are simply better than the guys on the other side of the field. We need better players and coaches who aren't afraid to attack. Donnie Henderson may not have had a great scheme but he had an attacking tough minded D that got in peoples faces. I doubt that their are many Offenses we are going to face this year that will ever look at film and be particularly uncomfortable facing us.
In a 3-4, you need a big NT, but you also need LB's who will take on blockers and blow up a play at the point of attack. We don't have that. And that is the biggest problem. Even with the Jabba the Hut playing NT, generally the NT is blocKed by the center, the ends are blocked by the tackles, and you have 2 guards to either double team a DLineman or get to the next level and take on a LB. Then you also have a lead blocker, usually the fullback but possibly a pulling guard or H-back. Either way, the thought that an ILB should be able to run free from sideline to sideline is fantasy. We are too small at the DT position AND we are too soft at the LB position.
I agree with everything you said here, other then the fact that Shaun Ellis is an 4-3 interior lineman. We tried that, years back, after drafting Bryan Thomas, and he couldn't handle it. I know he has never moved in space or anything, but if anything he might be worth a shot at outside linebacker. Bring in Pouha or Mosley to fill the nose slot, and move Robertson to end, where he is better suited. Thomas Vilma Barton Ellis.. Hey, you never know. At this point, it's up to Mangini to get big bodies on the field to keep blockers off Vilma and Barton. And putting Thomas Coleman Pouha/Mosley Robertson and Ellis all on the line of scrimmage gives opposing offensive lines a lot to worry about, regardless of the fact Ellis would be lost in coverage.
