The results are what they are. Herm did a reasonable job with the talent he was given and his teams generally beat the teams they were supposed to. But then you have what we and everyone else saw every Sunday on the sidelines, the baffled, confused face and the shucking, jiving, and always placing the blame on someone else after a loss. I'll admit that I was never crazy about Herm but after the despicable way he tried to pin the Baltimore game on Quincy Carter I was just done. IMO Herm is a below average coach, an above average motivator and a super media personality. This combo, along with the fact that he's black is just enough to keep him employed in the NFL, I'm just glad it's not with the Jets.
For the most part I agree with that, to me that's a more fair analysis. I respected that he entered the NFL as an undrafted free agent and elevated himself through the ranks to a head coach through hard work, I always thought that was a good trait for a coach to pass on to his team. In the end it's about results and Herm did a decent job. Not the greatest, but certainly not as bad as people here make him out to be. Imagine if we had this board back when we really did have some bad coaches here.
Champ, You really think by my post Im defending Herm? I think you should read it again..dancing on graves is not a compliment..I think you misread it buddy.
Here is the key. Thats the problem I have had with certain posters in the past concerning how Herm had a decent..decent amout of success. The Jets had the leading rusher in the NFL who didnt have a run over 25 yards that season. That is truly a statistic for the ages. It tells us that season, the Jet offensive line was pretty damn good...but we had a runner that lost anyway breakaway speed Maybe I overestimated the talent...but my feeling has always been that Herm had the horses. Either that..or he was an incredible x's and o's guy...nope.
I like mangini, I am very happy we have him but the biggest difference btw last year's team and this yer's is health and specifically the health of Chad. Once again I never claimed Herm was great but how do you explain 3 playoffs in 5 years(the only HC in NYJ history w/ 3 playoff appearances) after a stretch where we missed 2 straight years and 12 of 14 years and as a franchise only made it 8 times in 40 years before him and an AFC East title, one of only 2 HCs w/ an AFC East Title and we interrupted a dynasty in the process as we were trhe only AFC East team besides NE to win a div title since 2001. how did he blow it? B/c wash overpaid for him he blew it? we had a WR ready to step up and Moss filled his role well then when Moss anted a new deal we got the better Coles back for cheaper than what we would have had to pay Moss. He did a great job w/ all the redskin moves EXCEPT Chad Morton b/c he tried to match and that would have been a mistake but lucikly the arbiter was a skins season ticket holder. We eventaully replaced Hall w/ Nugemnt- upgrade, we replaced thomas w/ Kendall(though thomas is a little better we got pete at a fraction of the cost), We got Robertson out of the 1st Coles deal. he did a trememndous job, the easy thing would have been to overpay them and worry about the cap later but he didn't do that. If TB was just "OK" at talent evaluation then explain Jordan, Mckenzie, Thomas, Baker, Coles, Moss, extending Chad and Ellis, Rhodes, Cotchery, Houston, Robertson, Hobson, Vilma, coleman, etc... Champ's quote was under Woody the Jets would never, ever win a SB- Woody is still here. Oh silly me for wanting to win and enjoying the postseason, it was much more fun pre-Herm when we amde the playoffs 20% of the time compared to 60% under Herm especially when we were a joke of a franchise when he took over- NOBODY wanted to Coach here. Parcells walked out on us, Belichick walked out on us, Groh walked out on us- Dom Capers interviewed w/ us but didn't want to be considered for the job. NO ONE wanted to coach us and herm came in and made us BETTER in a tough division w/ a dynasty team in the division. No one is saying Herm is a HOF coach but he did a good job here and someday you guys will appreciate it.
How are we going to some day appreciate Herm? The guy is on his last job and will never be a head coach again after KC.... You wanna bet Herm is out in KC within 2 years, never wins a Super Bowl and NEVER is a Head Coach again? The rest of your post is regurgitation of the Mediocrity of Herm and Bradway.... Coles should have been locked up well before the Skins were able to fleece him.... I knew the guy was good, Herm called the guy the team MVP... He should have been locked up. The Chad contract was a fiasco... The whole Jolley thing was a joke, Dewayne could still be worth a top 1st round pick BUT TWO????? Jordan isn't looking so hot and he was greatly Misused when he should have been spelling Martin and giving us a glimpse at what he can do.... And I was freaking complementing Bradway on his talent evaluation anyway. Compared to showing up for work and everything elese he put his hand on he was a Genius evaluator!!!!! You keep pointing to W/L your stats but, you can't tell me Herm is going to out coach or Game plan a flea and you can't tell me the Bradway wanted anymore than a part time job in a position where people sleep at the office to gain an edge. Bottom line the guy is ruining Kansas City and will be out of work in no time while Mangini will become a top HC in the league for years.
You guys said he would never be a HC after the Jets and not only did he get another job but that team gave up a draft pick to get him. I agree Coles should have been locked up before the season ended but he made a mistake of giving fan favorite Chrebet a new deal but after he didn't sign him he did the right thing in the offseason. How did the skins fleece him? we were a kick away from the AFC Title game in 2004 and we were better thant he skins in '03, '04 and again in '06. The Chad contract was a fiasco b/c Chad got hurt, he did the right thing signing him(heck we'd have 3 wins right now if Chad wasn't here) but it was bad luck he got hurt. he was very wise not to make the same mistake by signing Abe. The Jolley trade was a joke? Really? You know what we got out of that deal? The best KR in the league, a K who is rounding into one of the best K's AND a possible all-pro Safety in Kerry Rhodes. yeah, dumb trade. Robertson was a PB caliber DT in '04 and is again this year, 2 out of 4 isn't bad and he's getting better. Check out what Chi got w/ those 2 picks. What has Jordan done in oak? he proved he was nothing more than a backup. How did we win so many games then? Did he have a magic wand? ruining? he has them in the playoff hunt and they lost 2 key OL in the offseason, their OC, their AP FB and lost their QB for most of the season. he's done a good job just having them in the race.
He also benched one of the most efficient QBs in the league for a 36 year old coming back from a concussion.
Damon's last game he was 15 of 38, 39.5%, w/ 0 Tds leading KC to 10 pts. I think he was getting off the Huard bandwagon at the right time.
What has Trent done? Lead the team to 16 PPG since he's been back? Throw over 200 yards once this year? Throw TD passes in 2 games this year? The only good game he had was against the mighty Browns, and he sabotaged a chance for the Chiefs to win in regulation with an INT, a game they eventually lost.
Got a quote?.... I fully knew Herm's Buddy was in KC and that was his only shot in HELL. When will you realize that the Jets front office and coaching ranks are BETTER OFF now than they have been in a long time... That is ALL we wanted.. That's it, better coaching and a full time GM, Simple... Why must I come here and STILL read you sucking up to these guys... We're BETTER off now, that's all. DONE. That's the bottom line.. There was a lot of room for improvement - We didn't game plan, adjust or take advantage of opponents weaknesses properly or freaking know how to runa CLOCK!!!!! and That's a fact... NOW we do... Simple..... Why is this such an issue with you to defend inadequacies by comparing what they did to 45 years of Jets football now during the age of parity..... Mangini's teams can not make the playoffs for the next 3 years and you know what... He's STILL a Better COACH than Herm cuz Herm was never a coach. Never qualified to be a head coach, the hiring of Herm was an absurd joke... Given his past and given the Jets past if you want to give the guy a passing grade then fine.... Most of us see the improvements. IMPROVEMENTS!
Exactly.. He was one of your examples of Bradway recognizing talent even though I said he was good at recognizing talent if nothing else.... The problem I had with Jordan is that he was misused by bad coaching.. The Guy shows promise on a few plays and he sees the bench.... He should have been saving Martin from wear and tear and used when a power back was called for.
Misused? he was a great backup and was so sought after a team agve him $25 mil. It sounds like he was used properly.
I think you just look to have the opposite point of everyone else. Power to ya... but arguing with you is like kicking a dead horse and I don't plan on doing it anytime in the future...
I present facts that no one can dispute, the herm argument is silly b/c I have all the ammo. His argument is he doesn't care if mangini never makes the playoffs b/c he'll still be a better coach than herm. if that's the case why keep records?
He needed to be used more in the Pitt playoff game and even the SD one as well. He was effective against Pitt but he only got 5 carries for 30 yards. Curtis on the other hand got 19 carries for 77 yards. Edit: Didn't he also have a long run that was negated by a Becht holding penalty? Either way there's no excuse for not feeding him the ball more.
GREAT POINT.... Every so often I shake my head at what Junc has said and then trys to make Champ out to be the bad guy... BOTTOM LINE: EVERYONE can see the difference now that we have a BETTER coach..... We needed improvement and we got improvement and that doesn't always translate in the box score but, again Mangini can "not make the playoffs" for years and based on FOOTBALL I'll tell ya forever that he's a better COACH than Herm.... But, I'll leave on this note from Larry Johnson regarding Game planning and such so typical Herm..... "Adam Teicher, of the Kansas City Star, reports Kansas City Chiefs RB Larry Johnson called out the Chiefs after the team's Week 15 loss. "We need to sit down and change something. This is getting ridiculous. Everybody is saying, `Oh, it's fine, it's OK.' I don't know who in their mind thinks this is OK. This is nothing that's OK. We need to change a lot of it. We need to sit down and change a lot. I'm getting tired of hearing that `We'll get `em next week' speech. We need to really start sitting down and knowing what we need to do to put points on the board and what we need to do to do win games," Johnson said. He said opposing defenses have made adjustments to what the Chiefs do and the team has not responded. "They need to fix it. I'm getting tired of this. It's tough running against a brick wall until you break it open, you know? You see other teams do different things; you see different teams react differently. Like I said, you don't have! to bang your head against a brick wall hard enough to crack a hole in it. There are other ways of doing different things." Head coach Herman Edwards said the team's offensive failings have not been because they are too predictable. Edwards feels the team is unable to find an offensive rhythm."
