I don't consider Jackson a reach at all, he's no more of a reach then Allen. I am just saying I would be royally pissed if we traded up for Lamar when we could've had him at 6 + our 2nd rounders. If Rosen comes off the board @ 2; I'll just shake my head.
I think that's an important point. Different teams fit players better or worse. In one of my posts I linked several articles describing Jeremy Bates system as OC. Based on what I've read about Bates, I think Mayfield is the best fit for the Jets. Beyond fitting the scheme, Mayfield is alone with Rosen in being capable of being a day 1 starter (as long as he can get comfortable taking snaps from center), and I also think Mayfield is the best leader / locker room fit by far out of any of the QBs. Rosen is a very good quarterback, I absolutely see why people like him in that regard. I don't perceive him to have Mayfield's leadership traits, Mayfield's energy, and I'm also concerned about his having been concussed twice last year. I was reading an article from 2016 that was attributing Rosens transition into a pro style scheme with him getting hit a ton. I'm nervous about him holding up physically. Mayfield had a concussion in 2015 and hasn't had an issue with that since. Darnold has mechanical issues and would likely benefit from half a season to a full season working those out before taking over. I can absolutely see him being a stud with the right team, but I don't think he'll be in the mix for rookie of the year. Allen needs drastic mechanical work in order to get his accuracy to an acceptable level. He has the most work to do of anyone in this class.
If we end up loving Lamar Jackson that much then it is what it is...no guarantee he’s there at 6 I would have stayed at 6 regardless because I like 6+ players along with the 2nd round picks But regardless I also think Lamar Jackson will be a very good QB and we’d be lucky to have him
Running out of the shotgun is difficult. If you go 75% shotgun, you basically telegraph the run when under center...IDK
The reason why I prefer Rosen is due to his football IQ, he is a master of his craft. He is wise beyond his years in terms of knowledge of offenses and defenses. Mayfield and Rosen are 2 completely different people with different personalities. Mayfield has that competitive fire, many players will put forth that extra effort for him. Rosen is the intellectual that will prep you in the film room, get the receivers in the right positions. Rosen has to learn that he can live for another down, I think he tries to make the big play too much. I'll take my chances with the concussions as long as the doctors and his family approve of it. I'll have to check out your posts on Bates. I haven't seen them yet. I am not that interested in Allen.
Bates system is heavily dependent on play-action and bootleg passing. Jay Cutler had his best season as an NFL pro under Bates doing this exact thing. In terms of the prospects coming out in this year's draft, Mayfield is the most effective QB outside of the pocket, in terms of both passing efficiency as well as escapability.
This is a big reason why I'm confident we won't be taking Allen. He's not good on the run and he's going to take years to get there. Bowles and Macc don't have years and Bates is probably right along with them.
i mean allen, mayfield, and jackson are all mid to late 1st rounders. rosen and darnold are top 5. i know the need for QB but a reach is a reach, of course if it pans out, nobody really cares
He's rarely ever run any real bootleg from center or true play action having to turn his back completely to the defense, only Allen and Rosen have extensive experience with that. Escapability is a great bonus, but you don't need it to run bootlegs and certainly not play action. An argument can be made that both Allen and Jackson are just as adept if not more at this. That aside, for bootlegs you just need to be able to throw well on the move and for play action you need to need to have good footwork, sell the fake and be able to reset your vision downfield after turning away from the defense. I agree based on his skill set I can see him ultimately excelling at running these type of plays. However, that projection. Without Mayfield actually doing those things on a consistent basis, no one can definitely say he is the best fit over guys that have actually done it and done it well.
No one was going to take him in the top 5 picks IMO. I mean I think I vouched for LJ a lot, but even I doubted him being a top 5 pick. but I agree, I would've stayed at 6 w/ our picks and just took him right there, unless I could get Rosen.
I only hope one thing and that is that Bates has a big say on what Qb they draft. I'm sure they have looked at 100's of hours of film On all of these guys and I am sure Bates will choose the Qb that best fits his system. It's not a popularity contest on who fans & critics Think we should take #3. They have to weigh all the strengths & weaknesses of each QB and which is coachable. After all Bates Is the one coaching him...let him choose his QB. The critics can't seem to agree on who is the best QB which leaves me to believe that there is not much that separates the QB'S. Personally I like Rosen....but I am hesitant due to durability issues. I think he would be the best WCO QB. Accurate short & intermediate & Can also throw pretty well down field.
I can't see an NFL team running 75% of their plays out of the shotgun but I don't see why Mayfield can't get his footwork cleaned up. Allen doesn't have footwork issues, his mechanics aren't screwed up. Guess most, not Rosen, need some fine tuning. Allen will benefit playing behind a real OL and throwing to WRs who don't suck
I'm with you, would love to see him succeed. He's got balls and we love that, especially in a QB. I just don't know if I would risk all at 3 for him. Tough call but in so many ways I think that Allen, if one of Darnold or Rosen is gone, might be the safer bet. You can't teach his measurables.
Problem I have is with the way people decide that a QB is inaccurate. It's not completion percentages. It's were the ball is placed. A 65% passer who's WRs makes acrobatic catches to inflate his number isn't accurate just as a 57% passer isn't inaccurate if his perfectly thrown passes are dropped by shitty WRs. Plus if you complete 20 of 35 passes you're a 57% passer and all of 2 extra completions or 22 of 35 makes a 64% passer. It's a lot more complicated than completion %. And I don't think most watch enough video to make blanket statements or don't know how hard or easy it is to fix
Allen would be fine in Bates's offense. Other than Jackson, Allen is the most athletic. Very good at boot legs. Watch the Senior Bowl where he was coached in a pro offense by pro coaches. He was terrific!
You simply can’t compare these guys (Mayfield vs Allen) on an accuracy standpoint. Better off sticking to size and arm strength if you want Allen. Mayfield may very well be the most accurate passer to come out in the last 5 years. His passes are pinpoint, and other than Rosen there is not another qb in this draft with his level of accuracy. After the combine, he said it himself... I’m the most accurate qb in this draft and it’s not close. Cocky kid, but Ive watched all his throws. He’s got an arm like Drew Brees. Accuracy is one of the things I totally don’t worry about with Mayfield... height, working under center, working in an NFL offense, footwork, yeah those are legit concerns... still wouldn’t keep me from drafting him #3...
