Your gift of justice,was an invasion of Iraq. The vice Pres already laid out the plan in the PNAC,stating we would need another Pearl Harbor to achieve it. Accepting the "oops,no wmds. well,they tried" is absolutely insane,and I still cannot believe that is just OK with people. This damn plane crash is getting more attention. The Bush administration should have been tried for war crimes As far as the Taliban,well,we put them there. And they were involved in business with Bush before he became president. that included a pipeline to the Caspian sea through Afghanistan. That didn't quite work out. Every enemy we have it seems,we were once friends with. Wmds in Iraq? well,yeah we sold them chem weapons to use in the Iranians. That's how we knew they might have some. The Taliban,Bin Laden? we fought with and trained them in the 80s. There are a lot of American companies that started profiting right away off 9/11. This list could go on and on. Its not that it wont make sense,its that people would rather not have to think that way if they have the choice.
This is true and fair,but news as a business is also swayed before being reported to gain public support for certain things. Look at that girl from Cnn,she admitted she was told what to say regardless of what she saw .
it seems to me that there would have to be way too many people involved in such a conspiracy for it to ever work without people talking. as for the wmds ... how long did we announce our pending attack prior to doing so? probably not long enough to move them to Syria?
Maybe so,but then again they could count on mass confusion,no united fronts on anything and the fact that the majority would never accept the idea that it may be an inside job. Its estimated that over 40% of people question the official story. That's not to say they have any belief on what really happened,just that they feel there is more to the story. As far as the wmds,I just don't buy that they were moved. Not very much really goes down on this planet that our intel doesn't know about. We were up their ass for a long time,there is just no way.
so you trust our intelligence community to know if things were moved but not to identify that they were there in the first place? I don't know how you can be honest with yourself and have it both ways. those people would have to be in on the conspiracy as well btw
Actually I've read plenty of reports that indicate the president of Ukraine has been calling for an independent investigation since it went down yet it's the "rebels" who are preventing investigators from getting in there. It's the "rebels: who have grabbed the black boxes and sent them to Russia. It's the "rebels" who are looting the dead bodies and personal belongings. Doesn't quite add up to Russia wanting an independent investigation. Your 2nd point, you are speaking as if it was done intentionally. I have a very educated guess that Russia has their hands in this but I don't have any reason to think it was done on purpose. It looks more like Russia fucked up and now they are trying to cover up their giant fuck up which is why they have the black boxes, aren't letting investigators get in and have sent the BUK back to Russia.
That's not it,i was saying that we had been up their asses to already have known they had no wmds,and certainly did not have the freedom to move them to Syria. It wasn't just us,it was the UN for over a decade. My point was the story about wmds as justice for 9/11 was fiction,sold to a weakened,desperate American public. edit-I took this off topic,ill stop
If you really want to find the truth, it's out there on the net. Every single point of the 9/11 commission has been debunked as there are groups of engineers, architects, pilots and dozens of other professions who all stake their reputations on the line for joining such movements for 9/11 truth. I personally scoffed at some friends of mine who suggested that it was all an inside job and didn't start researching this topic until earlier this year. The freedom of information act has put forth aviation records never seen before at that evidence alone is extremely damning but it doesn't stop there. Even though polls show that 39% of Americans (much higher figure outside the US) don't believe the 9/11 account, and that's a high number that grows every year, it's too big a leap for one to fathom (I couldn't) that their own government could be even capable of such a thing. I would ask that anyone who is giving their opinion on the matter to at least look at WTC 7 that fell. About half the country isn't aware that Bldg 7 was the third tower that fell that fateful day. Look at the freefall of that building that was not hit by a plane and then look at the twin towers. Fire didn't bring those down and every self-respecting architect and/or engineer will swear to that. We've been played. The rest of the evidence is out there as well.
Thanks for the reply. There are multiple reports claiming that each side has these dreaded black boxes. I don't know what to believe. And I wouldn't know if these had been tampered with (if they can be). I doubt we'll know the truth. But that's irrelevant in the bigger picture as the plan seems to be pinning this on the pro-Russian rebels to have the international community label them as terrorists so the UN/NATO and everyone else can join in on the fight for precious oil reserves in Ukraine. That's what this is all about. Watch for more stuff to happen if this doesn't work out the way the US wants it to. Notice they are the only ones screaming guilt towards Russia. Malaysia and Netherlands who lost all the people are waiting for the inspection to take place. As for pro-Russians somehow preventing the inspectors, that's not what I'm seeing on film. They are actually there. There's been no resistance. Everyone's been waiting. BTW, how did Russia fuck up? How did the Russian army sneak into Ukraine and proceed to shoot down a commercial plane? Huh? Really? The Russian army isn't there. This is a point you must answer if you believe the Russians did it. Beyond that, Ukraine dispatched the flight path to be changed. Where's the evidence? Without an inspection, how can anyone legitimately point a finger at anyone?
Thanks for the Fox News talking points. Every portion is wrong but I don't have time to refute such a lengthy post.
quote="Petrozza, post: 3025086, member: 1"]Ok, I'll go step by step.... very slowly. Those are Ukranians fighting their own (neo-Nazi) government in Crimea. We're talking about Donetsk here, not Crimea. You seem to be all over the place with very little substance. Do you even know the difference between Donetsk and Crimea? The neo-Nazi government you say? Here are the results of the last Ukrainian presidential election: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ukrainian_presidential_election,_2014 The ultra nationalist candidates, who you may call neo-Nazis if you want even though they are not, are Dmytro Yarosh and Oleh Tyahnybok - combined for less than 2% of votes. The parliament of the Ukraine: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Verkhovna_Rada The Svoboda party led by the above mentioned Oleh Tyahnybok has 7.9% there. So what neo-Nazi government are you talking about? Now, let's talk about these "rebels." The so-called Donetsk People's Republic (the separatists) is led by Alexander Borodai, who's a Russian citizen. Their military commander is Igor Girkin, a former FSB colonel from Moscow. He retired/resigned from the FSB in March of 2013. So, what do we have here? A supposedly local military force who happened to be led by two Russian citizens. I am sure there are some locals there as well, but the majority of those fighters are Russian/Chechen mercenaries who have gone through the Chechen wars and who knows what else. So, yeah Russia is not involved Again, Russia has nothing to gain from this. I don't even know where to start here. When the former Ukrainian president (a criminal with two convictions for robbery and assault) was overthrown, Russia lost one of their few remaining allies. They responded by taking over Crimea, making it look like they were protecting Russian-speaking people there. In reality, they just did not want to lose Sevastopol, the base of the Black Sea fleet, among other things. Now they are going even further, trying to destabilize the Ukraine as much as they can. They don't need the Ukraine to be part of the EU and/or joining NATO, as that would be Russia's worst nightmare. So, please stop spreading your lies. Thank you.[/quote] You're right about the pro-Russian army being led by who it is. But these are not funded by the Russian government as many are volunteers from Russia and most Ukranians from the Crimean region. So no, Russia is not involved. The Russian army is not there. Fact. As for Ukraine being destabilized, you are ignorant of what Europe and the US have done and conveniently started stirring the pot during the winter Olympics. Believe what you'd like. You're way off though and I encourage you to explore news sources outside the US. As for Russia going into Ukraine and shooting down a commercial flight in hopes of keeping Ukraine out of the EU (when the EU doesn't want them), I can't go along with that. You can though. My opinions gathered upon what I've researched are not "lies" because they differ from your US-born viewpoint. And the speaking very slowly tells me you can't handle adult conversations. I'd love to continue but I'm not going to be treated lower than what I'm treating in return. You are obviously patronizing me. And you're an administrator? WTF?
I wouldn't go that far - they were created by the US leading into the Afghanistan conflict in the 70's with Russia. CIA trained them well.
Are you serious? You expect me to believe that Putin would allow (not to mention the Russian people) that neo-nazi's could exist in Russia and live to tell about it???!!!! A very conservative figure of 25 million Russian died fighting the Nazi's and you come in here and suggest they're thriving in Russia today? I want to see some sources. And for what reason? No one knows the truth yet - no investigation has been performed. I don't and you don't. BTW, take a look at a documentary created by a independent BBC: Entitled: BBC Neo-Nazi Threat in new Ukraine: NEWSNIGHT
At 3700 degrees and when that happens, a slow degenerative side-to-side breakdown can occur. Those building went down at freefall. Explosions were witnessed by more than 300 people, many of them firefighters. Look at the evidence out there. Camera crews shows blown out portions of the first floors before the planes hit. More than this, the fire from jet fuel cannot exceed 2600 degrees. If steel were somehow to melt, the building wouldn't fall in free fall motion. Tons of concrete and steel still supported the building. Go visit Architects for 9/11 truth and tell me they're wrong. In the history of mankind, a steel building has never fallen from fire. Never. It's physically impossible.
even in common sense street physics,there is no way both building fall the same like that. The damaged part of the building would have fallen,not pancaked every floor down..unless...there was help.
I've been a sucker for all the years until very recently. We're conditioned to believe what we're told by our government and lackey media. I feel stupid for having ever believed the narrative. Now in this information age, the truth is much easier to find. Common sense should tell you that was impossible and most of the world thinks we are crazy to believe it all. They're right.
Just a little info for those who would like to read from an independent source from Canada that researches and deals with facts: http://www.globalresearch.ca/flight...stern-deception-was-it-a-staged-event/5392222 My favorite parts are that they take note who is pointing fingers - US and Ukraine. Everyone else is waiting on the findings. They believe Ukraine has the most to gain and would be most capable of conducting this event. Also, the passports are in better condition than any that I have or have even seen. They're shinier than a new penny. How did that happen when everything is a black, burned mess? The best part however is that someone captured a photo of the screen in Amsterdam showing that Flight 17 was cancelled on 7/17. Ooooops!!!! Cancelled??!! Something's rotten in Denmark.
