If you want to quote me - fine. Don't take the whole thing out of context. Big Blocker said something like: arm-strength throws like OUT were discarded (wrong) and Chad was still taking his share of shots downfield as the situation required it. (Yeah. Again, wrong on his account.) If you will, quote what Big Blocker had to say before as well. What if I tell you this was the first year Chad had his first red-zone INT in his entire career? And yeah. I understand it was more of a rebuilding year, with crap talent all over the roster. (Spearheaded by Dslob, of all people.) Does that mean Schottenheimer is exempt from the blame? 1. I agree that Jets winning 10 that year was a miracle. 2. That said, the production wasn't 10-win quality. That means Jets caught a lot of lucky breaks all over. 3. Great innovative, creative minds find ways to efficiently attack the opposing defense. That is not what Schottenheimer is known for. ---------------------------------------------------------------- Junc//I even provided why I started the whole thing. (Someone wanted a performance comparison among QBs under Schottenheimer's guidance.) If you don't care about that, just why bother posting? If you are taking issue with that, you should talk to THAT PERSON. (Man, do I have to tell you these little things too?) Ok. I am learning my lessons today - talking to a wall only leads to mental disorder. Check.
again, it's not as simple as putting up a chart for QBs w/ him and w/o him. There were major circumstances invovled, if you want to ignore that go ahead but those #s only tell a small part of the story.
Thanks!!!!! Finally back to the weasel that is Matt Cavanaugh... Not really. After the comeback win against Houston two years ago, Cav was seen chewing out Sanchez after the game winning TD. Great timing, and just fantastic stuff, I tell ya. I wanted this weasel gone for a reason. I don't know if Sanchez is that top calibre signal caller, but Tebow is definitely not that. He is white Michael Vick, only with terrible throwing mechanic. Lacks brain, cannot throw accurately and has to RUN to create viable threat. And Jets could have drafted Zebrie Sanders with that 4th rounder. That is still pissing me off.
You just don't get it, do you? It's not about Pennington's (or Favre's) performance under different coordinators. QBs w/ him and w/o him is NOT EVEN RELEVANT here. That's NOT what I am talking about, that's not even the point, and I didn't bother with that for a reason. For that reason I gave out the numbers, and the RELEVANT LEAGUE AVERAGE (not the career average of the said veteran, mind you!) LISTEN, GOD DAMN IT! (But then I am telling the wall to listen - fuck me.) It's PERFORMANCE COMPARISON under Schottenheimer. Why are you trying to bring in unnecessary external factors?
I like the discussion, didn't mean to pick on you. Overall I think Shotty and Mangini did a good job in 06 based on my impression that the team outproduced it's talent on both sides of the ball. Doesn't mean that much to me one way or another. I don't blame him for getting better overall results than I expected based on the talent and the fact that it was a rebuild. I credit him for getting better production than I expected. I can look at the stats in the rear view mirror and say not very good. But when I look at the team we fielded and the results in the rear view mirror I have a very different impression. Again I'm not defending Shotty, I just don't take it for granted that dumping him solves our issues on the field.
I would argue that the team allowed Brian and Mark to sling the ball more against Rex's core principles in order to give Mark a legitimate shot to show he could handle that kind of play, and he imploded. Now, if anything, Rex feels like his core principle (run the ball, play defense, and pass when necessary) were reinforced. Brian falls on the sword for it, now you bring in Saprano (a run-first to the extreme coach) and Tim Tebow (a run-first QB) and you are left with the pieces of Mark Sanchez having far less relevance. You tried to make him the Elite Passer with more passes than Runs, and you get 26 turnovers, a high-paid receiver benched in the final game, and total locker room turmoil. Those factors were all fact and acknowledged. So talking about Shotty is like wind at this point. He's gone. Its a new approach, and Mark, now he's getting called out for Last Year. That's a bad sign for Mark. Because that sounds like the past to me. Just my 2 cents.
I think the team passed the ball more because Greene couldn't stay on the field and there was little confidence in anyone else with any ability in the run game. The Jets have drafted 3 running backs 3 years in a row and the only back that could stay on the field that the coaching staff had any confidence in to not put the ball on the turf was a washed up Tomlinson.
That may have been the case, but the point is that you still allowed Mark to sling it around the yard like a Brady, Manning, or Brees and he imploded. I would argue had Mark taken care of business last year against Denver and Miami, we're not having this discussion about Tebow or Shotty being gone. And because of that, I'd also argue that I'd believe that Mark is the answer in the mind of the Jet's Brass had they never brought in Tebow. If they had brought in a normal back-up to push him, like Matt Flynn or David Garrad, or even Chad Heinne, then sure, Mark has a legitimate shot to out perform and show he's the guy. Bringing in any player besides Tebow, I'd argue that you'd have a strong case. But Tebow? You're changing philosophy 100% you do that, and that makes Mark the odd man out. Just my 2 cents.
No. You are bringing in unnecessary bullshits just for the sake of saying what you want to say. You do not contribute in any meaningful way whatsoever. (Is that how you make yourself feel relevant?)
I would argue that Mark Sanchez is a poor man's Chad Pennington since Chad has better stats when healthy and was a far better leader. He also had success going to another team (Miami) and was the comeback player of the year before injuries took their toll: so regardless of the coach, he found success, while Mark has been coddled and spoon-fed placating coaching and shielding from teammate's criticism and looking a Cav's comments, even shielding from effective coaching.
You can keep hurling the childish insults while pretending to know what you are talking about. I am sorry I hurt your feelings by actually bringing facts to the dicussion. Now back to posting stats w/ no context, you may have others fooled a bit.
you are excellent at hurling childish insults, I wis you'd spend more time learning the game so you don't just post stats w/o context.
I didn't hurl insult. I just described what I have seen without adding any flavor. If it makes you feel any better, you are excellent at ignoring whatever is said and screaming out whatever you have on your mind. That is the classic definition of human wall. No reason, no logic, just screaming what you want to spew out.
have to disagree. If the Jets brought in Matt Flynn, with the price tag he commanded and the game he had last year, he'd be an immediate threat to Sanchez and there definitely would be a QB controversy as well as a competition for the starting job. Tebow, at least looking at how he passed last year, was a "safe" option with a ton of upside. He's good enough to pressure Sanchez to some degree, but not enough to really threaten him. In short, I believe the thought is that Tebow would push Sanchez and make him better, without straight up challenging him. Added bonus would be the "wildcat" wrinkle and what Tebow's presence does to opposing defenses.
I don't ignore anything, you posted stats w/o context intended to make our former OC look bad w/o presenting all the facts. Where was the logic in posting stats w/ nothing else? But it makes you feel like you contributed even though you just skewed reality. Instead of moving on you keep harping on it while looking worse and worse in the process. Please tell me again how Vinny succeeding in 1998 was just like Favre in 2008 and also plase post that misleading sack stat. I notice you never respond to any points but instead just attack me, I wonder why that is?
As far as Tebow, that's the company line until otherwise, although like I indicated above, he can easily become a very real replacement for Sanchez and would not be a total shock if that happened or as far as the internal discussion, already is slated to become the starter. Also, my original point still stands since Matt Flynn is not yet the clear-cut starter in Seattle since they have Jackson and now Russel Wilson in the mix and since he doesn't have the following that Tebow has, he would not be as large as a controversy as bringing in Tebow. Flynn's contract means that they can cut him before the season starts, and he probably loses out on the majority of the money?
Heh.. "Something like" - not very something. Here is what i said: "Schotty developed a short passing attack to avoid the need for Chad to throw those downfield and out patterns, relying on the receivers to get yac." AVOID THE NEED here did not mean that situations would never develop that would in fact require that the occasional downfield or out pass be thrown, since as we all know who follow football, literally taking those plays completely out of an offense gives the D a great benefit and weapon. What I said and should have been apparent is that the short passing attack Schotty developed avoided emphasis on Chad's weaknesses. I never said what you claim I said. It is beyond dispute that the Jet passing attack in 06 was not based on stretching the field or on out patterns. Schotty's offense was successful and tailored to Chad's strengths and weaknesses. That about covers it.
