Thanks again TBird. I hope he sticks with the torp but I can fully understand his aprehension about shanking them. Maybe the NFL ball is better suited to punting spiral style but in Aussie rules it is an easy punt to shank and coaches do not encourage it. Accuracy in Aussie rules is more important than distance in 99% of situations.
Somebody from the Jets still needs to contact the FAA before the next practice and alert them to objects they'll be picking up on radar.
LOL, Frank. what "technicalities" are there that you don't get? I'd be happy to answer any Q's you might have.... if I have a specialty, it's kickers. Secondly might be O line, but I take a back seat to Kurt there, for sure. The kicking game is all about field position, ( to exclude FG kicking for the moment) and is a very under rated part of the American game. The coaches don't underestimate it, but the media and many fans do. I asked a lot of stupid Q's in the Gelong AFL site.... and people were pretty cool about answering a yank's questions there. If you really want to understand how Graham is doing, ask questions my man.... I have NO problem with that at all.
It's obvious he spent the last 4 months working on the torp. Out of what I'll guess was 15 punts, he didn't shank a single one. Even the ones he didn't hit perfectly went a long ways, with hang time. The NFL ball is DEFINITELY better suited to the spiral with the more pointed profile of the ball. It cuts through the air.
OK, You said /he said..asked First, he has seemed to abandoned that tumbling hard to catch punt that was good for 40 to 43 yards, We call them drop punts simulated rush ?? the coverage team will be all over the returner Please explain a bit he's less than a full ten yards from the LOS LOS???? haven't seen Ben try any T kicks T kicks?? This drill is done in order to teach the technique of the slot in protecting the edge and the line to the block point the slot in protecting the edge and the line to the block point ????duh Cheers TBJ, thanks for your kind assistance
Great work ThunerbirdJet! When I checked out the pics that Petrozza put up, I noticed Ben wasn't holding the ball in order to kick a 'drop punt'. He obviously has gained in confidence seeing as he's using the torpedos. This year you might see him mixing his kicks during a game. The opposition won't know what's coming next? By the way, how did your pumkin soup & pie turn out?
Frank, to save TBird valuable time I can fill you in with these 3 LOS = line of scrimmage T kicks = what Nugent does at kick offs, kicking the pill off a plastic tee Slot in protecting the edge and the line to the block point = this is obviously kinky bondage sex talk and frankly has no place on this board.
No problem, my man! Yes, the drop punt is something he wasn't using, although he was in a distance drill where he used the torp exclusively. I'm sure in situations closer to the other team's goal line, he'll use the drop punt to get it inside the opponent's 10 yard line, as he did last year. The simulated rush? Simple. The Jets players line up as the opposition would, and rush Graham. They won't hit him, but it does give the punter the feel of a rush to block the punt. That just forces him to get it off quickly, as he would have to do in a game situation. On a kick off, after a touchdown or field goal (which also happens at the start of the game and the start of the scond half) , the players that run down the filed is the coverage team. Their job is to tackle the opponent that has caught the kick off. Nugent handles the kick offs. LOS. Line Of Scrimage, where the ball is placed before it's snapped to in this case, the punter. Defensive players must stay on their side, offensive players on their side, until the ball is snapped. Place kickers, like our boy Nugent, make their kick offs from a ball holding device that keeps the ball erect for the kick. This device is called a kicking Tee, or T for short. So, Ben has not (apperntly) been practicing kick offs. On a field goal attempt, Graham holds the ball for Nugent, recieving the snap and holding the ball erect for him to boot it. On kickoffs, the ball is instead placed on the T. I'm guessing this last item came from one of the links I posted. As i read it out of context, i think the writer is talking about how the line is supposed to block, keeping potential punt blockers coming on the outside rush in check, and protecting the "pocket" where Graham will kick from.... about 9 yards behind the center who snaps the ball to the punter. This idea of the pocket is a standard American football term but most often used when referring to a QB who has dropped back to pass. The linemen will give some ground to the opposing pass rushers, but attempt to maintain a "pocket" where the QB will stay before throwing the ball. I'm sorry, but I have to say something here. 2004 came into this thread, made some very strong statements about my post in general, which seriously called into question the credibility of both the thread, and my football accumen. I was quite polite in my rebuttal, but although I know he saw my tactful counter-point, rather than admitting to having been wrong, just ran off and hid in a bunker. I think that is, well, pretty lame. Buck up dude, and admit a mistake. Anyone who posts a lot is going to be wrong once in a while. That is a fact. From the professional beat reporters to message boards, if you are out there, you will make some mistakes. I have no trouble admitting when I've screwed up, but I also don't go on the sort of attack you did here, claiming BS as fact. The litmus test is whether or not, for whatever reason, ego, whatever, is to buck up and admit when one is wrong ESPECIALLY when one is VERY wrong. 2004, you failed to show up. You told me HOW WRONG I was, and after I owned yer ass, you hid. Next time, especially if it comes to the kicking game, you better have yer freakin ducks lined up. Next time, tact is out the freakin window.... you don't deserve tact now, IMO. You wanna tell someone they don't know what they are talking about (in so many words) FIRST, don't be wrong as you were here. SECOND, admit a mistake. i doubt you'll even see this.... you are in the bunker, hiding. Pretty lame. Sorry for the rant, folks.... I hate people who shoot their yaps off as know it alls (even if they generally are great info people normally) and then when they get taken to the tool shed just disappear. Weak....
Great stuff T-Bird....I think its awesome that Ben has gone to punting spirals out there. Its a no brainer that they'll go farther than the drop punt that he used last year. He's gonna be a great weapon in the battle for field position this year! Thanks for the updates!
LOL! yeah.... 2004 is the unanamous salary cap expert here, and I defer to him on all cap issues. He has failed to recognize thet fact thay I am the resident kicking game expert here however. I would not tell him how wrong he was talking out of my ass regarding cap issues, he however farts wherever he likes, and does not say excuse me! He left a skid mark here that bleach isn't gonna fix. Dropped several notches on the T Bird respect scale. I'm sure that this will keep him up nights.
Boy, even TGG has specialist positions and special teams........maybe I might be a waterboy :breakdance: :breakdance: or beer boy :beer: :beer:
Watch a game and tell me how many yards behind the line he hits the ball... 12. If he drops 15 yds (we all agree) that means he catches it and runs up 7 yards? Tonight's not the night to get into an argument though, as I'm bitter enough about other subjects. There's no way they kick the ball 7-8 yds behind the line of scrimmage.. however, it's not worth argument with you, as all I'll see is capitalized text and yelling.. it's just not worth it. Arguments are no fun when you just get yelled at all the time.
OK, so even though I have proven you wrong beyond a shadow of a doubt, you insist you are right, but you refuse to engage in debate.... why? Because you think I was too forceful? Go back and read how you faced ME down in the first place, pal. Yeah, well I do agree with you on one thing.... it's pointless to argue with someone who may or may not know they are full of shit, but will steadfastly deny they made a mistake under any circumstance. I thought you were a really knowledgable poster.... but your ego shoots you down. Too bad. If you read what I posted, you might learn something. The point of attack for a block is 7 1/2 to 8 yards behnd the LOS. In drills, the pylon is placed nine yards behind the LOS for punt blocking drills. In your very lame response, you misquote me on EVERY number in a lame attempt to save face. Pathetic. That is because that is the point of contact for the punter.... nine yards behind the LOS, as I said quite clearly early on in this thread, I said "less than a full 10 yards from the LOS". I backed that FACT up with two links. Where are your links to back up your bogus opinion? Now, instead of either saying you made a mistake, or making a point to prove your position, you take your ball and go home.... those meanies! You are now even MORE full of shit than I thought you were before! I owned your ass here, and you are simply not man enough to admit it. And at first, I was VERY tactful.... but I saw you in this thread after those replies, and you just went away.... like a dog with it's tail between it's legs. Now, you pull the "you are a meanie" card! LMFAO! That is like something right out of Herm's play not to lose book! :lol:
I can make up a fake link to back up a point too (I'm not saying you did, but it certainly does not look official. However, I'll spare you the name calling).. but maybe Lange's article today proves you right beyound a shadow of a doubt.... Friday, August 4, 2006 Scrimmage on Chad Pennington stood out during the first scrimmage of Eric Mangini's first training camp as an NFL head coach. The scrimmage was of the no-contact variety, with each series a different game situation and was held on the Jets' own grass field, closed to fans. The easiest measure of the scrimmage was the passing. Pennington got the "start" and in four series, unofficially completed six of seven passes for 38 yards and the night's only TD pass to Laveranues Coles, plus a two-point conversion pass to Tim Dwight. The other quarterbacks' numbers: Patrick Ramsey, 7-for-12 for 60 yards, two sacks and two delays of game; Brooks Bollinger, 3-for-3 for 8 yards and two sacks, and rookie Kellen Clemens, 4-for-4 for 35 yards, all on one decent drive. Mike Nugent, who kicked a 57-yard field goal at the start of the morning practice, hit three of four tries in the scrimmage, from 40, 32 and 49 yards, with a 49-yarder falling very short into a stiff wind that suddenly sprang up ahead of the welcome cold front. Ben Graham had a punt blocked. Mangini, apparently going soft on the seventh day of camp, held his two shortest practices of camp Thursday (2 hours, 11 minutes and 2:10) and canceled today's 2 p.m. scrimmage, although players are still reporting. The Jets' practice Saturday afternoon at Giants Stadium, 2 p.m., is open to the public free of charge. Briefs College scouting coordinator John Griffin, a Jets employee for 26 seasons, has left to become assistant director of the National Scouting Service in Indianapolis, which administers the NFL combine workouts. ... G Pete Kendall, who injured his arm Wednesday, didn't work in the scrimmage. ... S Erik Coleman (flu) was still sidelined, as were DTs Sione Pouha (knee) and Tui Alailefaleula (knee) and TE Jason Pociask (shoulder). ... WR Dante Ridgeway joined them with a knee twisted on a Kerry Rhodes takedown during tackling drills Wednesday. -- Randy Lange
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bF6S0-A2UHg&search=devin hester Maybe we're both right. Ball is kicked from the 16, LOS 27.. drop back is 14 yds. Looks like we need to split the difference and say you were a little under the #, and I may have been a little over the #.
I thought the LOS in that vid was about 23-24 yard line, receives the ball at the 14 and kicks it at 16. Little fuzzy on LOS tho, near as I could tell.
Geeze, I was ornery yesterday! (the AC in my den crapped out). That's my excuse, and I'm sticking to it! Looks to me like the LOS was the 25, recieved the snap at the 13, and his point of contact (where his foot was when he met the ball) was at the 16.... so, this is in line with the punt block drill, where the cone is placed at the point of contact, nine yards behind the LOS. That's why the "block point" is a yard in front of that... at 7.5 to 8 yards behind the LOS. You got the approach distance right, 3 yards. We were both wrong on how far behind the LOS the punter lines up though. I knew it was nine yards at point of contact.... I spent enough time last year watching Graham for those weekly reports to know that much! If it were any further away from the LOS, every punt made when a team is backed up at their own 2 would result in a block, otherwise. (My AC is fixed today)
It looked like the 27 to me, but no point in arguing... as long as the getting punts blocked crap stops I'm cool with 42 yd punts.
