Wasn't that his strategy after his first season as our OC in '06? I seem to recall he was actually offered 1 or 2 HC jobs after that season (Miami? Washington? I can't remember specifically) and turned them down, probably with the expectation that the Jets offense would continue to improve and he would end up with a higher profile HC job. Instead, '07 and '08 were marked by generally poor offensive performances by the team and the HC offers disappeared. You would think he would be unlikely to make that mistake again, and would grab any HC offer that came along this offseason.
I have made plenty of valid and structured arguments about the playcalls, and haven't seen you make any real arguments against them. And the one you just made is so surface-based and shallow that I am not surprised, either.
First of all, I have seen very few "valid and structured" arguments about playcalls on this board. 90% of it is "Schotty is too cutesy". "He doesn't run the ball enough!!!!" "Who cares about 8-9 man fronts!!!! GROUND AND POUND" To be fair, I haven't specifically made notes of any of your posts, but I really don't feel the need to. The bottom line is, most fans bash play-calls when a given play isn't successful. It's just that simple. I hate to break it to you but fans just aren't qualified to make detailed critiques about play-calling. Sure, there are always situations when you can make a general statement about running instead of passing in a given situation (or vice-versa), but the bottom line is, there is a lot of preparation that the coaches do in order to come up with SPECIFIC PLAYS for specific situations. Without knowing exactly why a coach made a certain play-call in a give situation, most criticism tends to be rather SHALLOW (to use one of your own words) and baseless. Secondly, I find it remarkably ill-conceived to want to get rid of Schottenheimer after only one year with our rookie, franchise quarterback. It just seems to me that it would be far more prudent and beneficial to Sanchez to let him grow as an NFL quarterback in one offensive system for several years. If you look at the few franchises that are consistently successful (winning teams) year in and year out (Pats, Colts, Eagles, Chargers, Giants, etc), the one thing that sticks out at you is the stability in the coaching staffs. They tend to stick with offensive and defensive systems. They promote from within the coaching staffs when a coach leaves. (etc, etc, etc) If Schotty is so terrible, then why in the fuck is he so popular outside of the organization???? Why is he so lauded and respected by other coaches in the league?? Why did he get a head coaching interview two years ago with the dolphins???? Why are the Bills interested in him now??? Why does the Jets organization like him so much???? Why was Mangini so in love with him? Why does Ryan have his finger up his ass in every other press conference??? Is it possible that maybe (just maybe) NFL coaches and NFL general managers know a little bit more about what makes a competent coordinator/coach than you do???? Maybe??? Finally, this is all moot anyway because the guy is obviously not going anywhere. Let it go.
Sorry, had that song in my head when I read that.. Bohemian Rhapsody... There have been a few good threads on Schotty and he has some valid knocks on him. If you went back to the threads on the Buffalo game I am sure there were plenty made there. It's becoming like beating a dead horse though with the conversation though.
SO TRUE. This is just one of those issues that Jets fans are going to be divided on for all of eternity.
Let it go? This is a message board designed specifically for the discussion and debate of football, and specifically the Jets. Your post basically denies the reason it exists. I have seen plenty of fans on this and other board that are qualified to break down football, far more than any sports journalists that people seem to take at face value. People like you seem to completely discount the knowledge of fans and just tell people they aren't qualified to discuss a subject and move on. If you personally don't feel qualified to discuss a subject, maybe you should just avoid the subject instead of pretending to offer an argument by dismissing the opposition's argument. That is weak-minded. Where is Schotty 'so lauded and respected around the league'? Can you show specific examples, or are you just making that up? Care to share a link? Or at least 2, since it seems he is a living legend in the minds of his peers? Maybe it's because of his last name? Plenty of unqualified candidates get head coaching interviews. He was 1 year removed from being a QB coach when Miami interviewed him, how did that work out for Zorn? Is Jim Zorn also lauded and respected around the league? Even moreso because he actually got a HC job? By the way, the guy that got the Dolphins job was fired after 1 season, so I guess Miami had some pretty high qualifications for that job, huh? Strawman. Schotty's father has connections with Buddy Nix, the new GM in Buffalo, so it was pretty predictable that Brian got interest up north. It's not like teams are salivating to steal him away from us. Because there really isn't a reason to. You're right, most fans will emotionally bash the playcalls without knowing why or supplying a valid solution, but if all you can do is bash the bad arguments and dismiss them as lacking knowledge without ever providing a case of your own for Schotty, then your argument is for shit. And it's worse than theirs, because it is even more lacking in substance than theirs is. You can fake-argue your 'point' all day long, but it will never change the fact that Brian Schottenheimer is far from being above reproach. We just traded up for a franchise QB, and the way this situation is handled is going to be viewed with a microscope no matter how loudly you fanboy him to the rafters.
He has no offers to be a HC. This is the best gig he could possibly hope for. he has been dreadful at times this season. He has been less dreadful recently.
Did you actually watch the press conference? He dropped so many "um's" and "uh's". No way he can handle the media as a head coach.
I want to see Sanchez learn the flow of the game before the cuffs come off. I'd prefer a Bob Griese approach to the game next year or instead we'll be watching the second coming of Brian Griese. Totally serious about this by the way, Sanchez attitude is way ahead of his experience at this point and until he settles down and learns what you must not do I don't want him chucking the ball around all that much. He's not Dan Marino or Peyton Manning.
How do you know?? Nobody knew Tom Brady was Tom Brady until he became Tom Brady. I just want him to be our QB for a long time, he's shown flashes of brilliance and I don't want him to lose that in the monotony of handing it off 85% of the game.
I think you're criticizing for the sake of criticizing here. Since when is eloquent speech a necessity to be a NFL head coach? I actually thought he was good behind the podium working with the press. Very poised, seemed knowledgeable and comfortable up there.
I remember reading a few years back right before we hired Mangini that Westhoff had a surprisingly good interview for the Jets head coaching position. I think someone mentioned that it was just a courtesy interview, but he impressed Woody so much that he became a legit candidate. Speaks for his attitude and character, definitely one of my all-time favorite coaches
"This is a message board designed specifically for the discussion and debate of football, and specifically the Jets. Your post basically denies the reason it exists" I'm not sure what that sentence even means. I have no problem with people discussing anything they want regarding the Jets . . . I'm just saying that I don't believe the constant nitpicking of the playcalling is warranted. I don't see why that offends you so much. "Where is Schotty 'so lauded and respected around the league'? Can you show specific examples, or are you just making that up? Care to share a link? Or at least 2, since it seems he is a living legend in the minds of his peers? Maybe it's because of his last name?" There have been dozens of reports of Schottenhiemers popularity both within the organization and around the league. If you honestly are unaware of this, then that's not my problem and I have no interest in proving it to you. My suspicion is that you are aware of this and are just being intellectually dishonest because you don't like the guy. (Btw, the contention that the Jets themselves are very happy with schotty has actually been posted about on this board many many times - with most posters displaying disgust over this. There have been news articles, as well as, Greg Gumble saying during the Colts game that Ryan told him to his face he wanted Schotty back) "Plenty of unqualified candidates get head coaching interviews. He was 1 year removed from being a QB coach when Miami interviewed him, how did that work out for Zorn? Is Jim Zorn also lauded and respected around the league? Even moreso because he actually got a HC job? By the way, the guy that got the Dolphins job was fired after 1 season, so I guess Miami had some pretty high qualifications for that job, huh? Strawman. Schotty's father has connections with Buddy Nix, the new GM in Buffalo, so it was pretty predictable that Brian got interest up north. It's not like teams are salivating to steal him away from us. Because there really isn't a reason to." The Zorn example has no logical bearing on what we are talking about here. Namely because We are talking about Schotty's qualifications as a play-caller and offensive coordinator. I've have never said (or even implied) that I think he has earned a shot at being a head coach. Also, just because Cam Cameron was 1-15, doesn't mean he wasn't qualified to be a head coach. Maybe they didn't have any good players???? Maybe they needed a guy like Parcells to come in and give them a solid draft/offseason?? Again, you are oversimplifying things and making assumptions you really can't make. "People like you seem to completely discount the knowledge of fans and just tell people they aren't qualified to discuss a subject and move on. If you personally don't feel qualified to discuss a subject, maybe you should just avoid the subject instead of pretending to offer an argument by dismissing the opposition's argument. That is weak-minded." A) I never said that I wasn't qualified to discuss anything. I said "most fans" aren't B) Most rants on this board about Schottenheimer are littered with buzz phrases like "Ground and pound" and "cutesy" and have very little in the way of legitimate analysis. I'm not sure how much more clearly I can say this or what exactly I would have to do for you to be satisfied that I am properly backing up my opinion. C) "weak-minded"? If you say so . . .:beer:
Implying to people that they don't have any business arguing a point is what it means. Maybe you should re-read your own posts for clarification. Dozens, huh? Then it shouldn't be too difficult to find a LINK. Oh, that's right, you have 'no interest in proving it to me'. Good job avoiding the argument, because there aren't any reports. None at all. I have no disgust over it, if Rex truly feels comfortable with Schotty running his offense, then the proof will be in the pudding. Like I said (and you predictably ignored), I like a lot of what Schotty has been doing lately, and I hope he keeps that trend going. But it won't keep me from criticizing him when I see a terrible drive-killing play-call on Saturday. You have no problem assuming I dislike the guy because that is what weak-minded individuals do. You were the one that brought up the interest that other teams had in Schotty as a HC candidate, the Zorn example (QB coach rushed into a HC position) has everything to do with it, and your remarks on that are an example of your inability or unwillingness (see Post #19) to understand it. 'Most' arguments against those buzz-phrase-littered rants (yours included) are nothing but half-assed dismissals of the 'Schotty haters' without any intelligent arguments to back them up. Do the oversimplified criticisms that 'most' people make bother you? Maybe you should put together a halfway intelligent case for why he is a good playcaller instead of pointing at phantom 'reports' about the lauds of respect that he is getting around the league. Oh, that's right, you have 'no interest' in making arguments like that. I hope I was 'clear' enough for you. Qualified, indeed.
How do I know? Well he's nowhere near as good as Dan Marino and Peyton Manning were as rookies. Not even in the ball park. Yes, Manning threw a bunch of picks but he threw the ball 575 times as rookie to get there. He was also throwing the ball as the Colt's first option on the season. Brady is an invalid comparison for two reasons, first he did not play as a rookie and second, he played light years better than Sanchez has when he finally got the opportunity. The guys you could maybe compare Sanchez to at this point are John Elway and Terry Bradshaw, both of whom struggled mightily in their rookie seasons and neither of whom was the kind of instinctively great QB that Marino and Manning were.
"Implying to people that they don't have any business arguing a point is what it means. Maybe you should re-read your own posts for clarification." If that's what it meant, it wasn't worded very well at all. "Dozens, huh? Then it shouldn't be too difficult to find a LINK. Oh, that's right, you have 'no interest in proving it to me'. Good job avoiding the argument, because there aren't any reports. None at all." You're clueless. (Btw, you conveniently ignored the mention of what Greg Gumble said during the Colts game to an audience of millions of people) "I have no disgust over it, if Rex truly feels comfortable with Schotty running his offense, then the proof will be in the pudding. Like I said (and you predictably ignored), I like a lot of what Schotty has been doing lately, and I hope he keeps that trend going. But it won't keep me from criticizing him when I see a terrible drive-killing play-call on Saturday. You have no problem assuming I dislike the guy because that is what weak-minded individuals do" A) Again, I never said you didn't have the right to be critical of Schotty's play-calling. What I have questioned is the actual merits of the "arguments" people make about Schotty's play-calling. B) Another inference on your part that I am weak-minded . . . you must definately not be weak-minded because you obviously have some sort of magical power that allows you to detect specific character flaws based on a person's writing in an internet forum. Stay classy. :beer: "You were the one that brought up the interest that other teams had in Schotty as a HC candidate, the Zorn example (QB coach rushed into a HC position) has everything to do with it, and your remarks on that are an example of your inability or unwillingness (see Post #19) to understand it" Uhm, actually no. I brought up the reports of Schotty's potential head coaching candidacy as a way to put into perspective the overwhelming Disregardment of Schotty as a serviceable NFL offensive coordinator on this board. Some of the things written about him on this site are utterly comical. The fact Zorn was hired as a HEAD COACH and failed miserably has no bearing on anything I was saying. I'm not sure where you are going here . . .
