Mangini is getting ripped- rightly so (see Gary Meyers column Sunday in The NYDN) -- but let's not let Tannenbaum off so easily. This guy was CLEARLY the prime mover in getting Brett Farve here when there was NO COMPELLING reason to move away from Chad Pennington (who was EASILY beating out the 'annointed' KC in the QB competition at the time of the trade). Yes, I know that 95% of the NY media and probably 95% of GangGreen.com favored the trade (I'm proud to say I did not at the time). But the trade for Favre ruined this team. Yes, Tannenbaum is good with the cap and he had an otherwise great off-season getting all the FA's. I won't rip him on the draft because everyone thought VG was the pick at #6 though I think Tannenbaum should have told Mangini to play Ghoulston more where appropriate and stop with the Bill Parcells-Terry Glenn-treatment. Here's why Tannenbaum failed: he should have realized that Favre, playing in the weakest division the last 10 years, was NOT the same QB as 10 years ago. You don't trade for a high-risk QB when your team is much better with a low-risk QB like Chad. Favre 10 years ago? No brainer. But anybody who saw Favre, even last year, knew that he was NOT the QB he was even 5 years ago, let alone 10. Passes he used to thread and get to the WR were being deflected or picked off. It's the equivalent of a fastball pitcher who can no longer throw 95 MPH but throws 90-91 and still throws it over the plate: it's still a decent fastball, but that little extra is missing and now hitters can catch up with the pitch. Ditto Favre and his inability to throw as hard as in the past. I never understood this fascination with Favre. I know alot of Greenbay fans and while they appreciated Favre and wanted him to go out under better circumstances and also acknowledged that the team the last few years was no way as good as that from the 1990's they also knew that Favre HAD detereriorated where it mattered. Look...if Chad Pennington loses a few MPH off his throws, it hardly matters, the guy isn't a high-risk thrower anyway. But with Favre...that missing speed is critical. Just because he throws alot harder than Chad doesn't mean he can thread HIS passes past the defense because he's going to attempt throws that Chad would NEVER do (or most QB's for that matter). I can't believe that Mangini, despite never being a Chad fan, was the mover for Favre. I think this was Tannenbaum thinking that if BF could lead an otherwise mediocre Green Bay team to the NFC title game and give the Giants a good game (despite playing poorly), what would he do with good WR's.....with Leon and Jones.....with a revamped OL....etc. I think Tannenbaum got snookered and failed to do his due dilligence by looking precisely at the teams Favre had beaten the last few years (mostly NFC and under-.500 teams) and also taking into account the declining arm strength. It doesn't matter that Favre's arm is still better than 90% of the QB's...it has to be better than 98% of them, because of the nature of those throws he lives (and dies) on. Even when Favre had great seasons, my friends who watched every minute of every GreenBay game would tell me that every game there were 3-4 throws that any other QB would have picked off but that BF got a completion simply because of his rocket arm. No more rocket arm = no more miracle completions = more interceptions. The Grand Experiment may have looked good at 8-3 and maybe even with a mediocre Favre the Jets should have/would have made the playoffs if Manginin had not coached in such a gutless manner tha last 5 weeks (Herm Edwards made dumb calls, but did even Herm make that many bad calls in so many consecutive games with a playoff run on the line ???). Let's face it: this team effectively lost it's last 5 games (forget the Buffalo gift) and finished 8-8 after starting 8-3. It's the worst collapse alongside the 1994 team after the Marino Spike Game. Pete Carroll got fired for that game....let's hope that Woody and/or MT have better luck if they decide to can Mangutless than Leon did when he brought in Kotite.
I don't blame the move to bring in Favre. I felt it made a lot of sense at the time the way he had played in the previous year, and I didn't think our ceiling was very high with Pennington at QB. Favre was absolutely a risk, and many risks fail. This one certainly did. If you told me we were bringing in Favre two years ago, I would have agreed with you. But Favre was a very, very good QB last year. While it was unfair to ask him to equal that, it showed that there was something there, and if he could re-kindle some of the magic he had last year, the Jets might be looking at 12 wins.
That being said, getting Brett Favre was a disaster. We did not need to give up a 3rd round pick to go 9-7 and miss the playoffs yet again. I thought we could have went 10-6 with Chad, when we got Favre I figured on 11 maybe 12 wins. Obviously I was dead wrong, and by the looks of things we would have been better off with Chad. Regardless, because we will never know for sure, but it's quite obvious that Chad was not as bad as we thought and Favre was not as good. What pisses me off is that the same sh*t people killed Chad for they make excuses when it comes to Brett. As if Chad did not have to deal with the same staff and players minus a crap load of help on the O-line, an awesome full back in Richardson and a real promising tight end in Keller. If you bashed Chad for his mediocrity, then you should be killing Favre because he sucked so much worse than Chad ever did.
I blame the move as being ill advised and unnecessary. Tannenbaum deserves a good deal of the criticism for this season, but not enought to cost him his job.
Tannenbaum has done a good job overall, he missed on Gholston for now(hopefully he gets better) and Favre but he's mostly hit on trades, FA and the draft.
I disagree. I think tanny did a good job bringing in talent, and he should not be blamed for Mangini's piss poor job of coaching.
But the OP is talking about bringing in Fvre. You dont blame Favres PATHETIC season on Mangini do you? Mangini was a disgrace and should be gone by lunch time...But Favres disaster of a season is not Mangina's fault.
I think you are missing a few things: Favre's "great" year of 2007 was the result of great weapons. Green Bay receivers had the most YAC of any team in 2007. 5 yard passes that become 40 yard completions on the stat sheet make a QB look "resurgent". The Jets don't have a Jennings or Driver. Washington is really the only "playmaker" they have. The NFL caught up with the Jets following Tennessee. Have you watched the Dolphin highlights this year? How many plays have Pennington throwing the ball downfield? That's a coaching problem. The Dolphins can be credited with the "wildcat" can the Jets staff produce an unconventional plan?
I don't blame Tannenbaum at all. He brought the players in here. Pennington and Clemens were terribe in TC this year and Favre was available. Favre had an unbelievable season last year what else was he supposed to do?! He did what he should have and that was to bring in Favre. Tannenbaum is the last person that should be blamed for what happened over the last 5 weeks.
I'm withholding judgment on Mike Tannenbaum. It doesn't take much savvy to hit the market with a fistful of cash and start buying up players. The real test for him will come in the next few years, particularly if the NFL maintains a salary cap. But it all begins with how he handles his own two biggest mistakes - Eric Mangini and Brett Favre.
I disagree with your basic premise. The NYJ would not have brought in a vet QB that Mangina did not want. They rolled the dice with him and it came up craps, but MAYBE if -Schottie's offense wasnt so easy to defend against, they'd have done better. The rest of the league caught up to him rather quickly after his first season. -Maybe they should have realized that they had a RB who was leading the AFC in rushing for a while, and should have focused on power football instead of gimmicks and empty backfields. -If EM and BS wanted Chad here this season, he would have been here, and they never would have traded for Favre. It's not as though Chad WANTED to leave- they pushed him out. They get no pass for bringing in an older vet QB for the vet QB they already had.
Pennington for Favre basically straight up was a no brainer. Except for NYJUNC and one or two others -- you all chased ol noodle arm out of here with pitchforks and torches. Tannenbaum has been very very good. Was there someone you wanted that we didnt get? The running game has two good backs. The OL line is very good. We need linebackers and wrs.
Tannenbaum is NOT off the hook by a long shot. If they want to hire Parcells or Cowher they will bith want to be GM too. At that point Tannenbaum is history.
All true, but who could have known? They made their Brett of Nails and now have to lie in it. Chad - Hmm, well had he been able to put together the same caliber of play this year up here we would be division winners, but there are no crystal balls in football. Did we get screwed; sure, in retrospect, but at the time the deal was made I and most of this board was all for it. Thankfully it only cost us a couple of picks (a third rounder and the pick we lost for not being able to trade Chad). Still not team debilitating in the short or long term.
I agree. Faneca, Jenkins, and many others are all MT players. I do not think (other than Goul -- and its still early) there are other moves that he made but should not have. That Favre move made total sense.
Are you insane? Everywhere Parcells has gone he has tried to get Tannenbaum to come with him. When he was in talks to go to Tampa, when he went to Dallas and Miami, Parcells tried to get Tannenbaum. He LOVES the guy. Tannenbaum has been a great GM, one of the best we had. He has had very good drafts with Keller, Washington, Mangold, Brick, Lowery, Stuckey, Revis, and Harris. He is keeping the young talent in house with Rhodes and Cotchery. He finds players like Clowney and Ratliff on the scrap heap. He acquired players like Jenkins and Jones in trades. Got value for our players, Abraham, Vilma, and Kendall. He atttracts free agents like Pace, Faneca, and Woody. The Favre trade was the right move at the time. And Gholston is a bust (it's early though). Overall he has been fantastic in increasing the talent and acquiring the pieces needed to succeed. The problem the coaching staff didn't know how to properly use those pieces.
Tanny had the chance to bring in a future HOF-er and pulled the trigger. Even if it turned out to be a bad move, and even though I didn't think it was a great idea at the time, I can't fault him for that. I'd prefer a GM who takes some chances to a guy like Bradway who hides in a hole. And the collapse isn't Favre's fault. When one player is in a slump, a well-balanced team should be able to pick up the slack. The Jets were well-balanced everywhere but on the sideline.
