Chad is better than quite a few starters right now and just about all backups. The problem is he can't last a full season because he is a bit fragile and he isn't the future any more. He has had his opportunity with our franchise and has been penciled in as the starting QB for 5-6 years. I think that is giving the guy a heck of a chance in this league. He still might be our starter, but his injuries have hurt this franchise time after time. Its not his fault, nobody can fault his brain or heart, but his body has been his problem. His arm isn't as bad as advertised, but he does telegraph some throws because of his slow motion.
[I posted this a couple of weeks ago. tomdeb...why the personal vendetta against Bryan Thomas? Over half your posts spew the same thing about B.Thomas and misinformation about his contract. At this point, Thomas, who is a good player, is pretty cheap.] http://forums.theganggreen.com/showthread.php?p=795224#post795224 Despite every post by tomdeb criticizing the FO for giving Thomas a "25 million dollar contract," BT was given only $9mm in guarantees on a 5-year deal. A number that now pales in comparison to Paces $22mm in guarantees. The total value of the contract is $25mm, but (assuming rotoworld's info is correct) Tannebaum front-loaded it big-time. Thomas received $6.7mm in salary in 2007, and then has salaries of $1.7mm (2008), $1.9mm (2009), $2.5mm (2010), $3.2mm (2011). If the cap number reported in another thread is correct ($4.5mm) the Jets could still cut Thomas before June 1. The remaining pro-rated portion of his guarantees is $7.2mm ($9mm / 5 years-life of contract x 4 remaining years). Prior to June 1st, the accelerated $7.2mm can be split between two seasons, so the Jets would carry $3.6mm of dead cap money attributed to Thomas in 2008 and 2009. More realistically, the Jets will let Thomas play out this season and see if the additions on defense can motivate/help him. Then next offseason, cutting prior to June 1st would force the Jets only to carry $2.7mm in dead money in 2009 and 2010.
Chad is probably gone. Getting his 6million off the cap would help the team much more. Hopefully we can get a draft pick, because if a rookie or new backup QB has to run the offense, looks like we are mostly going to run the ball and depend on the defense even with Chad here.
With all due respect, Blair, if you give a guy a $9M bonus AND pay him $6.7M the same year (2007, according to your figures), you should be getting a little more than a guy who you want to "play out the season and see if the additions on defense can motivate/help him." I would think the $15.7M that Thomas pocketed last season would be enough motivation, but you apparently differ--I guess his 2.5 sacks last year looked pretty good to you?
Well, in my opinion, you've got part of it right. The BS offensive strategy relies upon play action passing. You have to get the defense out of position in order to get your WRs downfield -- this requires the good faking of a run play, and the belief that the run will damage the defense if they don't stop it cold. In order to fake a run, you have to have run well against this defense. Otherwise, they could give a damn about your fake. It is true we should be able to live quite comfortably off of our running game. Otherwise there will be no passing other than the short out which will become a turkey shoot for the defense without running, and without down deep, and with lots of pass rushing. Get it? Run to score. Run to set up the pass. Then maybe pass. But run to defeat the defense. First and foremost.
Why worry about sacks when the NYJ can't stop the run? You know, all this judgment of people based on their sack totals. How about how well they handled their assignment on a particular play? Do you think that every snap it's Bryan Thomas' job to go and rush the passer? What if he rushes the passer, and they are running toward him and they seal him out and the RB runs inside of him for 18 yards? This game is more complicated than sacks and TD passes and INTs.
sure the game is more complicated KC&K but seriously for the 15.7 million we payed thomas to be a PASS RUSHER, if he didnt blitz on a whole hell of a lot of snaps last season the coaching staff is truly a bunch of idiots. So if we are to assume the staff is not that stupid, on a whole hell of a lot of snaps that he blitzed on, he came away with 2.5 sacks, so not exactly good numbers from the guy playing the position that is supposed to lead the defense in sacks. Thomas was supposed to be our Merriman/Suggs/Ware, so I would assume that they would give him those oppurtunites to be that guy, more info in favor of thomas pass rushing not being so good last season....
I know...it's about WINS and Thomas and his 2 sacks "helped" us win 4 out of 16. Beat that logic homie. WINS, Sacks, TDs, and INTs >>>>> Other, less important, less in your face stats
To be fair, good players make impact plays regardless of what they are asked to do.... Vilma, for all his struggles in the 3-4 against the run, was a terrific, impact player in coverage while he was healthy... Can you name one impact play Bryan Thomas made last season? Do you remember noticing that the underneath/flat routes to his side of the field were covered like a blanket at any point in the season? I don't.... Check downs and screen passes worked like a dream against us all year... Do you remember Bryan Thomas doing a good job stringing out outside running plays, or turning plays back inside? I sure don't.... Hobson, for all his struggles, was much stronger at the point of attack, and thus better defending the outside run plays than was Thomas.... How about wrapping up backs and receivers quickly to prevent YAC? No... More often than not, he was a non-factor- only decent- in pass coverage, while getting caught up in the wash on running plays. Sure, he's not rushing the passer every play, but that doesn't mean he can't make an impact. The fact of the matter is that he was INVISIBLE last season. A 3-4 defense is designed to free up the OLBs to make plays against the run and against the pass, and Thomas rarely did either... I don't know how anyone who watched the games could really defend his play last year.
DWare, why did we lose? Because we didn't get enough sacks? I would say that the three and outs that our NYJ offense became infamous for in 07 served to wear out the defense so that the other team could run on them with abandon, and then pass on them with abandon. We lot a lot of games in the fourth quarter. I think this was the reason.
The defense played remarkably well given the fact that the offense forced them back on the field quickly over and over. in fact, although the defense broke down early in the season, after the bye, they began to evolve and execute schemes that enabled them to take the initiative, even though the offense couldn't hold its own.
The overall team is impacted by the offense and by the defense. When you isolate on one guy you miss a lot of the factors that are determining the game. Overall, the NYJ are far too weak on offense in 07, and just holding their own on defense in 07 to isolate on a single guy and run him off ... with few exceptions. We have released some of the abominable OLs that were at the root of this season's demise. Do you seriously think that the CS agrees with your assessment enough to run off Thomas as well? Do you believe that they are missing something that you portray as glaring as that? Why aren't the CS and the FO reacting with the venom and revenge that you express about this guy, Bryan Thomas? Could it be that there may be more to the problem that just Thomas' miserable lack of competence and no-account attitude?
Jdon, when the OL can't run block, and the OL can't pass block, then the run fake is not respected, and the pass rush is effective, so after a couple of plays the DBs are instructed to jump the short routes. The reason is that the QB (whoever he happens to be) is not being given enough time to allow the WRs to get downfield, and he has to get rid of the ball or get mashed and sacked. No running game, and good pass rush takes away all options other than the dump it now or get killed. Take a look at Tom Brady in the SB. This is what an aggressive, overpowering DL did to the premier quarterback in the NFL. Why don't you think that an woefully underachieving OL can do it to any QB we put in there?
it's a whole lot easier to stop the run when you face qbs who can't throw more than 7 yards more the twice a game with any zip on the ball. you can load up the box, wait for rainbow passes on out routes, and have your defense put up touchdowns on the board.
it's the other way around. The first thing a defense does is stop the run. That means they smash the OL in the mouth and throw him out of the way. Then if there's a runner they can brutalize him at their ease. But if the QB is stupid enough to be passing, then they lick their chops and chase him down. The defense is focused on taking away your strongest stuff first -- for most OL the preferrable effort is to aggressively run block, not play catch for a pass play. By stopping the OL in its tracks and cramming the run, the DL does three things to the pass play: It takes away any time to read the defense and find the open man; it takes away any timing between the QB and the WRs because they force changes in movement of both; it takes away the deep pass play because the QB can't wait for the WR to get downfield and separated from his DB because he will be blasted by the unblocked LBs and DLs first. QBs don't get a chance to throw the ball on an NFL team if they can only get it seven yards down field. If Chad were as bad as you continue to claim he is, then what does that say about Chris Palmer, and Brian S. and E. Mangini? You mean to say they don't know what the hell they're doing? That they purposely and stupidly throw a guy who's arm is so shot he can't throw it downfield on the field with the NYJ to be victimized? If you really think this, then you must have a very low opinion of the CS and should start another thread on getting rid of the Mangini regime. Because all this criticism of Chad is really an indictment of the CS.
The entire defense was terrible last season, that doesn't mean that there weren't some good players. Thomas was rather disappointing last season, however, relative to his contract going forward there really is no reason to get rid of him. If all you had to do was throw millions at a player and he'd be motivated, than entire NFL would be playing the game 2x better than it is now. My question (that you still have not answered) is if Thomas is such a non-factor why are half your posts about him and the mistake Tannenbaum made in signing him.
Mr. JetsLookingforDWare, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.
The game is won in the trenches, man. That's the only way a lot of your "more important" stats come about.
