The blame for the Jet's miserable 3-12 season is on Eric Mangini more than anybody else. He's the one who totally misunderstood what the Jets key needs were in the offseason and concentrated on doing other things instead. He thought the Jet's weak running game last year was due to a lack of talent at runningback, not a weak offensive line. So he traded for Thomas Jones to remedy that problem. With a game to go in the season the Jets will not surpass last seasons rushing totals, because the problem was not the backs, it was the line, and this season while the backs are better the line is worse. He thought the Jets weak run defense last year was correctable by adding a backup defensive end as his starter at RDE and adding a strong rookie linebacker to the mix. Well, the Jets run defense is worse this year than it was last year, because the problem is his scheme just sucks for the personnel he has available. He did add a strong rookie CB to the mix, however - surprise, surprise - the Jet's pass defense is also worse than it was last season, allowing more yards per game, a higher opposing completion percentage and fewer interceptions, creating a much higher opposing QB rating. Nothing that Mangini did in the offseason had the effect he intended, with many moves backfiring. He wanted to create more competition in camp so he brought in a bunch of no-names to compete for startng positions. Most of those people went away, but - surprise, surprise - when you allow Adrien Clarke to compete for a starting position you sometimes wind up watching him destroy your season, as he did. The in-game coaching decisions have been largely indefensible and the Jets have played very poorly in the second half, indicating that the adjustments the coaches are making has been ineffective. While the Jets aren't talking about it much the facts are that Mangini has lost the locker-room. It's now a normal occurrence for players to warn each other not to answer certain questions from reporters in the locker-room after the game. It's become a normal occurrence for players to roll their eyes and shrug instead when coaching decisions are questioned. There's just no reason at this point to think Mangini can fix any of this, let alone all of it. We're probably going to live through another 4-12 or 3-13 season next year before he gets the boot. Really, why do we need to go through this? We all know what a bad coach looks like and Mangini has been there from about game 4 onwards. Nothing is going to change that.
I feel your pain... But Mangini is still a young coach.... And if you ask me, will be a great coach one day. Rome was not build in ah day... Just go ask BB, and go look at his coaching career in Cleveland... Its called a learning curve, and Mangini will do just fine. We have lost 7 games this year by 7 pts or less... Mangini is not the problem.
Yes but what about the 2006 draft, we picked up two great linemen and a great support RB (Washington). You also can't argue with Harris and Revis, whether Mangini percieved that those positions were "needs" is irrelevant, he didn't pass up on some good talent. My point is that even though Mangini has failed to see the root of the teams problems, its not like hasn't brought talent onto this team. Hopefully, this year he'll figure it out (I mean its so freaking obvious what the team needs right?).
QFT. I think of it more like Crennel/Savage in Cleveland. They've stuck it out and now they have one of the best offenses in the NFL to build on. And Mangini hasn't lost the locker room. This team still plays their asses off. Got to love when a guy finds a way to complain about our two draft picks that are legit DROY candidates and cornerstones for the franchise. What other 3-4 end candidates were their last offseason? Hindsight is a hell of a weapon. Coleman was a Parcells recommended player thats been a pretty good player for us. What exactly were you expecting? Two years and we'd have alot of elite/very good players all signed and ready to go?
Anytime you lose seven games by a touchdown or less (not to mention the ones where we were within a touchdown before Chad tried to run his two minute pick drill); you need not look much further than the coach and the coaching staff; which in our case is simply putrid.
Mangini was a late hire in a year of a ton of turnover in the NFL. We had the last picks in terms of staff and we brought in a lot of second tier staff under a very inexperienced HC. The Jets were a veteran team with no QB, no OL, No DL an a depleted secondary, WR group and our star RB career was over. After an 8 year run with Parcells groceries the team had been run into the ground by Herm and Bradway. Mangini with all his inexpereince brought total dedication to this team and a new work ethic which translated into a surprisingly good season last year followed by a great draft, more cap space added and another year for the QB of the future to sit and learn. I love the fact that we got two great players rather than 4 bodies who may or may not be here in a couple of years. I don't want a rebuild that gets 9 or 10 wins every other year an a quick exit from the playoffs. You need great players to advance and it's going to take a few years to assemble a team of great players when you take over a 53 man squad as depleted as ours was. It didn't work out this year we were over matched physically at the point of attack, Pennington was again expossed for what he is but the young players drafted turned out to be special players. Mangini is clearly not the problem, the over all staff is a problem as is the talent level on this team which needs to be drastically upgraded at several positions. You can skape goat Mangini all you want, the team is well prepared and has played very hard all season, he hasn't lost the team and the locker room seems to be very tight when a QB controversy could have easily split this team apart. I always believed this was bad team coming into the season and we would struggle but probably end up a 6 or 7 win team. I'm not at all surprised by the teams record, when you have a young OL with two bad hold the fort players and a terrible OL coach you have problems. When you have a QB with a shot arm basically restricting the O to playing 5 yard football, it's not all that tough to defend no matter how many trick plays you run. When your warrior WR who was brought in because your QB couldn't get the ball to your game breaking No. 1 pick WR and needed someone to fight for 5 yard passes you have a team in trouble.
It's funny how there's 2 camps on the 7 points or less thing. Some seem to think the reason we lost is due to a talent shortage. Others place blame squarely on Mangini's inability to make good adjustments at the half. I'd say it's a combination of both, but with a slightly improved roster from last season (bar Kendal) I'd say more of the blame goes to Mangini.
It always ultimately rests on the shoulders of the coach - but you really can't get blood out of a rock. He makes rookie mistakes - but his players play hard for him. The one thing that Sperm Edwards had going for him was his ability to motivate the players. That ability came because they loved the Club Ed atmosphere. It's fantastic that Mangini gets his players to give their all out of respect. That is the 1st step to building a winning franchise. I have full confidence in Mangini and look forward to what he can do with a few more ingredients in the cupboard.
These are all valid points. I do hope you are wrong about next year being another 4-12 season. We just don't know yet. I think next year will be better if: 1. We don't mess around in the free-agency market with regard to the offensive line. I think that is the most paramount importance to next year. We absolutely have zero chance of fixing our offensive line using the draft alone. I say we should give the money to Faneca - why? He is only 30 and has a Super Bowl ring. He will give our offensive line true leadership and experience. We desparately need it. What did Parcells do right away when he came here? He snatched up Mawae and gave him the money - was he right? Sure. He knew that you need that quality anchor in your line. Mangold is solid and I do not see any issue with keeping him. I do not think he is in the same ilk as Mawae though, at least yet. Other available offensive line talent worth getting in would be Lilja, Flozell Adams, and Max Starks. There are still others available, but they would be chances age-wise, injury-wise and talent-wise. If we get 2 out of the 4 I mentioned, and then supplement them by using a 2nd or 3rd round pick for best available lineman our offensive line will be very noticably improved. 2. We need to do something to become better against the run on defense. Unfortunately, I do not see any realistic way of filling the NT position for the Jets maligned 3-4. What can be done is see if we can get Suggs and/or Haynesworth. Drafting Chris Long if he is available would not hurt us either. Especially if we move down from where we are now by beating KC and Long happens to fall to us. If we remain high in the draft by losing to KC I would love to trade down if possible, but I don't know if anyone would be interested in trading up. 3. We do need to draft or sign a new wide receiver threat that has some speed. I can not see Moss coming here for a lot of reasons that have nothing to do with money. The guy probably will be wearing a Super Bowl Ring in February. The thought of down-grading from wear he is now and what he was able to achieve under Brady will bother the heck out of him. He will not want to go to a re-building team. I actually see Moss excepting a reasonable offer from NE and financially working with them. The below is not my full list and I haven't analyzed cap hit yet. Keep as back-ups only: Clement - unless we can replace him in the latter rounds of the draft we still need some depth - he is not starting material and never will be. Moore - pretty much the same as above Let go and/or trade the following people: McCareins - just enough already; trade for a pick if possible, but he has to leave. Adrien Clarke - show him the door promptly Clint Oldenburg - I have seen enough to know he will never help us Trade Chad Pennington - provided the guy does not get killed against KC he definitely can be force on the right team and the Jets are not the right team in our current state. Trade Coles - Coles is good (he has defintely given a lot to the Jets) and I would miss the guy; if we do keep him it is only for another year. He is getting old and he has taken a beating; he also does not have blazing speed, but he does have great hands. Trade Vilma - he is just too small at ILB. Harris has proved that he can handle the load of not having a true NT. Vilma is good, but I do not see him as a good fit for our future. Trade Ellis - he has done nothing this year. Get a decent pick for the guy. We need to make room somewhere for the obvious additions we will be getting on defense. Note: As much as I love McFadden; it would be a huge mistake for this team to draft the guy given our current obvious laundry list of problems. If we improve our offensive line with the guys I said then Jones will definitely do better as a guy who can grind out 5 to 8 yard gains and occasionally go for a 20 to 30 yarder. Leon is a guy who could really blossom as a take to the house back with a better offensive line. He is not a full-time back, but he has proven he has all the moves to be a long run threat. I see McFadden as a wasted pick because he gives us things we techinically already have between Jones and Leon. Jones and Leon need a line as would McFadden; drafting McFadden would not be objective based on team needs; it would be the sexy, stupid pick.
I don't get this "they play hard" garbage. What the hell does that mean? To me, playing hard results in wins. I don't see these guys playing any harder then the Dolphins or Raiders, or even the 1-15 Kotite team. That team also lost a bunch of close games. Were they "playing hard" for Kotite? Its an excuse for a dearth of talent, brought on by a cheap owner, and an inexperienced in over his head head coach. "They play hard for him" is the biggest bunch of crap I ever heard. Want to show you buy into a coach's system? WIN GAMES.
So the talent that Mandoofis thumbed up for the season and his game day decisions result in game after game of ‘almost winning’ but this somehow does not rest primarily on his shoulders? I think you are swaying toward agreeing but don’t forget that it is the coaches job to recruit the talent he needs for his schemes. EDIT: I’ll also place some blame on Woody being a cheap shit; yep…I’m coming full circle around here and realizing that Champ 69 is right. At first he bothers the shit out of you with the same repetitive posts but god dammit – he’s right; we are never going to win anything with Woody as our owner because winning doesn’t mean anything to him. Watch us sit on our asses in FA again this year.
No I completely believe that our second half collapses are on Mangini's coaching prowess. He unquestionably made errors with the talent that was brought in as well, but I don't completely blame him for that. If this CS and FO shipped Kendal out over a measly 1 mill, you have to wonder what kind of spending restrictions were placed on the signing of potential free agents in the first place. We will find out this offseason without question...the holes are painfully obvious and there will be FA talent available to fill some of them. If we see the same sort of trash brought in next season as we did this season then I'd tend to believe that Woody is being a tight ass more so then Mangini is a poor judge of talent.
If this does happen, I definitely will be going to the Woody is a cheap SOB Camp, and we will never win a SB under Woody - essentially, I will become a perennial Darksider. There is simply no excuse to not being able to sign big name talent to our offensive line given the number of offensive line FA's and the fact that we do have money to spend because we have our cap under control.
Bottomline is Harris and Revis.... If those picks failed we'd all be able to shoot Mangini out of town... But, if you go into the offseason and you look to aquire the best talent they could - they sure did that with those two guys who will be cornerstones for this defense...... This wasn't going to be a Championship year no matter what - So, they got to see Clemens play a lot... And now, as fans, at least they were smacked upside the head with the fact that the OL SUCKS...... Last year the team came off just drafting two top OL draft picks so, yeah, the WRONGFULLY felt they added enough talent - And I just think Kendall was a complete blindside by an Jerkoff..... You need to keep drafting well to build a winner - This past offseason they drafted well - You keep doing that and eventually you'll win in spite of yourself, if it comes to that....... And Offensive lines are funny - This past offseason the Giants OL was supposed to be one of the worst in the league - They are manhandeling people - and pretty much clobbered the Bills yesterday in the line matchup. So.... It's another offseason: 1) DRAFT WELL - You don't always fill holes but, you MUST get the talent like they did 2) Fortify the lines 3) Find your QB As stated - Rome wasn't built in a day...... Here's to ANOTHER great Draft!!!!!!
I just don't get where you people are saying that Woody is cheap. Woody is a "hands off" owner - he lets his GM and HC make all the football related decisions including signing and drafting players, and all contract negotiations. There is not a shred of evidence of Woody telling Tanny to be cost conscious that I'm aware of. If anyone has evidence of this I'd love to hear it. If you want to say that Woody made a mistake hiring Tanny/Manny or that he needs to take a more hands on approach, that is a different story. But if you're going to call him cheap, back it up with credible evidence.
We will see this offseason. As I said in a prior post, if they bring in nothing but retread trash when there are obvious holes on this team, there are only 2 reasonable conclusions to come to. 1. Mangini really is an awful judge of talent. (Which is contradicted by picks like Harris and Revis) 2. Woody is a cheap SOB.
The fact that he tried to steal one of the most valuable pieces of real estate in North America and when he couldn't steal it didn't come up with additionl money might be one. The fact that we have one of the lowest paid staffs in the league and Herm essentially left for money might be one? The fact that Parcells is in Miami and BB is in NE might be one? The fact that he ripped off the season ticket holders by forceing them to buy upfront parking when they were making the parking situation a dissaster for them might be one. The upfront money for waiting list might be one? I really can't think of a single reason to call Woody Cheap.
