Clemens/Pennington

I totally agree with the OP, Look at me past posts to see that I have always been for keeping Chad in and not starting KC, It has nothing to do with Chad. Everyone is just frustrated and thinks a NEW QB will be a miracle answer to all the bad crap about the Jets. WRONG people, learn the game.

 

I have no doubt that clemens gives the jets a better chance to win just because but in all honesty, some of the pennington haters made it seem like we had joe montana in his prime in the healm on the bench. I think Clemens could be pretty decent but I haven't seen something overwhelmingly obvious that makes him the QB of the future.

 

DOesn;t mater who is back there when a 300 pound asshole is a foot in front of him 1 second after the snap. Truly, Chad would have complete more passes today....but i know thats not the point now...

 

I'll tell you what I think.

KC has one win in 4 starts now. Balt-loss, Was-loss OT, Pitt-win OT, Dal-we got crushed.

Chad had one win in 6 starts. His lone win was against the still winless Dolphins by a measley 3 points.

As someone else pointed out earlier in this thread, Chad's losses came to a Bills team decimated by injuries, Eagles had injuries, the Pats are better than us, the Bengals game he actually had a pretty good game--against probably the one of the worst defense in the NFL. "Hey, the Bengals have Carson Palmer and pretty good weapons why do they lose?" No defense.

Bottom line, I would rather someone who has a pretty good drive in the 4th qtr against an awesome Bal D in his first start, lose in OT (were up in the game), beat the then #1 D in the league in Pitt, and lost today. Everytime we get beat by 31 points from now on, are we gonna say Chad could've done that? Chad could have done that, but if we were close, he would've thrown a pick in a crucial situation.

Look what happened to Peyton Manning against a good D (like the ones we have been playing Wash, Bal, Pitt, Dal). Without Marvin Harrison, he was running around like a chicken with his head cut off and his timing was all off. So when we get LColes back, he'll be able to be much more poised in the pocket.

I don't understand how you can even compare a Rookie QB without his #1 against good D's to a broken ass vet with no notable injuries against sucky teams. That's basically what I'm getting at. Your logic escapes me.

 

Great post. I haven't been too impressed with Clemens so far, but it's still very early.

 

QFT...

Why I bother to enter these threads at this point, is beyond me.... In fact, I've found that talking to fans of other teams I seem to hear more logical opinions on the progression of Clemens than I do with Jets fans...

Pennington seems to have put a spell on many Jet fans since 2002, and I fear our judgement as a fanbase is damaged foreverhmy:

 

A defense that stood up against the run and held Roethlisberger in check, and our o-line somehow comming up with some run blocking.

 

So that we can get over this - I will pretend to be every guy who claimed that this season was all Chad's fault. I thought that we had the 2nd coming of Joe Namath in Clemens. He was to be our savior and accomplish all that Pennington could not. I was wrong. It was not all Pennington's fault and now I can see that clearly since Clemens has gotten his shot. I apologize - Chad deserves better.

There - are you happy?

Now can we leave the Pennington discussion on the bench where it belongs.

 

Well, let's see what Clemens can do against the Dolphins. If he struggles against them, they we can start to worry. If there's one team that Chad excelled at beating, it's the Phins.

Don't be surprised if the Phins get their first win against us unfortunately.

 

Poor KC - he does not have Coles to throw to....ahh that's right (using Chad haters thought process) he got Coles hurt by stretching him out...remember??

Chad had two potential career ending surgeries and even after that earned the NFL Comeback Player of the Year award in 2006....you guys want to keep calling him noodle arm....let's cut open any NFL QB's shoulder like that twice and see if they do not get a little gun-shy and see how far they can then throw the ball down the field....you guys are pathetic. Oh yea - what's KC's excuse???? He is the young stud with the cannon arm that can spread the "D"...hmmm...really??? Although Chad was never really known for throwing a lot of deep balls, I would argue that Chad's deep passes this year with a screwed up shoulder were more accurate than KC's.....that is really sad. Anyone can whip a ball down the field....let's see if Vinny T wants to come back. He's older that dirt and more accurate than KC.

Then we have the kid is young and only in his 4th game....give him a break. This is the NFL boys, it's a big time business. I hope KC is the answer and the future but I don't see it. I hope he does great against the Dolphins and Browns D's....we shall see.

As far as the debate on this board goes....the KC lovers said that the Chad lovers were drinking the kool-aid while wearing rose colored glasses....what have we really learned? Our offensive line is horrible, our defense is improving (and that is a good thing). The more we see KC play the more we think that Chad was not all to blame and KC may not be the second coming after-all. Now it looks like the KC lovers are drinking the kool-aid and wearing the rose-colored glasses.

I have said it many times....I hope you are all right and KC is the real deal. I also hope that Chad gets with the right team next year and can end his career on a high note.

Go Jets!

 

You only have to look at one person to blame. It is not CP or KC but it is BS.

 

Seriously I just can not understand all this bullshit black and white thinking. It is like a bunch of third graders arguing.

Why do people think that stating, "Chad is washed up" is tantamount to hating or wishing him bodily harm or something? or that in thinking this, that the person somehow wants to rip KC's jock off with their teeth.

Look anyone that watched the first 8 games and thinks Chad is not washed up is watching a different game than me. Now, I like Chad, always thought he was a decent QB and did nothing but earn the respect of teammates and fans alike. However, he is no longer capable of being an even mediocre NFL QB. I do not hate him or wish him any ill will.

Now about KC. Is anyone thinking he walks on water? F-no. Does anyone think he has been the second coming of Dan Marino in his first year? F-no

Great now we have that out of the way .

People that did not want Chad in as QB any longer and wanted KC in have seen the good and the bad of this thought process. The growing pains, the lack of O-line and the poor WR play has a lot to do with the fact that KC has not been a world beater. Yet we will get the last minute drive that we got in the Pittsburgh game, a drive Chad is no longer capable of making. So take the good with the bad.

This is the perfect time to have KC as QB and learn the ropes and get much needed experience under his belt. So that when/if the O-line gets 3 additional much needed NFL caliber starters he will have more then a fleeting second to make a play and that the running game will improve. Seriously, Manning or Brady would not have won today behind this O-line and WR corps, Chad certainly would not have.

It is not about manlove for KC or hatred of Chad. It is what is best for the future of the team. How can anyone dispute the fact that KC starting now offers the best hope for the future of this team/franchise.

 

Because they were lulled to sleep by Chad's amazing 124 yards on 15 completions.

I'm trying to tell you that Chad deserved a shit ton of the blame. Because now this team still has those broken parts, but Clemens is making it just as close to these top tier NFL teams and losing just as miserably to the elite teams (Cowboys Pats) in just his 4th start with the better part of 2 games without Coles, too.

No team would be "turned around" after a 1-7 start. None of us thought that. But I honestly think that Chad's 4th quarter interceptions and inability to provide versatility to the offense were a HUGE reason in our ineptedness.

I'm providing a good argument, don't come at me with the post count bull.

 

I'm sorry, but I just don't get the criticism of Pennington and the praise for Clemens. As bad as Pennington played this year, he has never in his career had 4 consecutive starts as bad as the 4 games Clemens has started.

With Pennington this year we had no running game, few touchdowns, and losses. But we also well over 50% completions, and more TDs that picks.

With Clemens, we have a QB that has shown no accuracy whatsoever. He is completing less than 50% of his passes in a league where less than 60% is unacceptable. He has thrown twice as many picks in a league where good QBs have 2 to 1 ratios of TDs over INTs and average QBs throw more TDs than INTs. He has a big arm, but has not shown the ability to hit open receivers. And we still get have an offense that does not put points on the board. I understand that Clemens needs to play the remaining 5 games of this horrible season, but I wouldn't get rid of Pennington just yet.

Pennington is a proven winner playing on a bad team. The last few games showed that the problems with this team lie in a bad offensive line and a defense that needs more playmakers. Pennington at times this year was too conservative and then at other times he tried to do too much. That happens to QBs on bad teams. Favre looked done 2 or 3 years ago and now surrounded by talent, he is thriving. Has Bulger become a horrible Qb or is it that the Rams stink? Palmer had 3 picks returned for TDs last week - why do you think that happened? Rivers looks bad this year after looking so good last year. What changed? (that is a rhetorical question). Vince Young has a running game and a defense but can't pass to save his life.



If Clemens continues these games where he completes 40% of his passes and has single digit completions entering the 4th quarter, then the Jets do not have their future QB starting right now. I'd love to see him succeed, but he looks far worse than anyone could have expected and the excuses being made for him right now are inappropriate and ironic given the criticisms leveled at Pennington this year.

 

in attempt to stop this incessant flow of ignorant crap, Clemens played a very good team, without his #1 WR, on 3 days rest and most likely 1 1/2 days preparation...hes a young QB that is still learning, and with all these different variables...it showed! We have nothing to worry about...its not like he threw 4 INTs..he had a bad game, but by no means was it atrocious.

Pennington/ Clemens evaluations need hold off until the playoffs.

 

He wasn't hyped as the second coming by most of the posters on the board. He was hyped as the person we absolutely had to look at before the draft next year so we could make an informed choice as to what to do on the first day.

At the moment we still don't know. I think he's promising enough to continue to play and evaluate however he clearly has not come in and grabbed the reins and taken the job.

The overall situation remains as it was when Chad was in, which is that the offensive line is too weak to play against most defenses in the NFL. they just get pushed around in a big way. This is a long-term structural deficit that has just gotten worse and worse over the last few seasons. It needs to be addressed in a big way before the Jets will be ok again and before we can properly evaluate any QB.

 

everybody gets lucky once in a while

 

Sorry but it was pretty atrocious. Some Bad Decisions , Bad innacurate throws and the Deer in the headlights look at times with the pass rush coming.

Oh I know he had no running game -- Wait I thought the lack of a running game was Chads fault becuase he couldnt stretch the D and Clemens would change all that.

Lets build the Lines with trades , FA and ,some later picks but the #1 needs to be used for a franchise QB.

Dallas was #24 against the Pass before the game - they are a good Team yes but they are not the 85 Bears.

 

I know, let's go over to old mission hill and dig up the grave of old trigger. Have your guns ready, cause we're gonna shoot him up good 'n full of holes. Then we kick his carcass repeatedly until it falls apart at the seams. Finally, we'll bury the pieces because that's all there is left to do.

But wait...didn't see this one coming...someone's gone 'n dug up the pieces so they can strap them to a big ol' rocket and blow ol' trigger up some more 'cause they just don't believe that horse is dead yet.

WORST THREAD EVER!