You're right on Favre, Montana and Fouts who I had forgotten. Moon was undrafted and would have never played in the NFL at all if not for his years in Canada. I think it was racial with Moon and with Montana I think it had to do with the league being down on Notre Dame QBs for some reason. Staubach was only taken in the 10th round because everybody knew he had 6 years of service in the Navy to do first or he would have been the overall number 1 pick.
I think Staubach would have come out with Namath and had there been no AFL Namath probably would have been the No. 1 pick. If Clemens didn't break his leg he probably goes in the first round and possibly before both Cutler and Leinart.
Namath was 1965. Staubach was 1964. Namath was drafted by St. Louis with the 12th pick in '65. Butkus, Sayres, Craig Morton and Jack Snow all going ahead of him. To think that Chicago got Butkus and Sayres with the #3 and #4 picks and then Steve DeLong at #6 and Brian Piccolo in a later round. What a team that could have been. http://www.profootballhof.com/history/general/draft/1965.jsp
Based on his production at Oregon Clemens might well have gone in the first round and possibly as high at 12-15. He would never have been a top 10 pick. He's not tall enough nor did he have the rep of having an outstanding arm.
I don't think his height is the issue people are making it out to be... As myself and another poster were discussing earlier in this thread, Clemens stands very tall in the pocket, and has a nice, high, over-the-top release... If he were 6' I could see it being a problem regardless, but if your mechanics are excellent, 6'2 is a fine height for a good QB in this league....
The last QB under 6'3" that was taken in the top 10 was Donovan McNabb in 1999. the only other guy under 6'4" taken in the top 10 in the last 8 years was David Carr at 6'3". Like it or not height is now a strongly determining factor in whether or not a QB is considered to have star potential.
But we've seen plenty of success amongst the guys who are under 6'3, considering the small number of them.... Brees had an MVP year last year, McNair went to the Super Bowl with the Titans, as did McNabb with the Eagles. Kurt Warner went to two Super Bowls and won two MVPs, as did Brett Favre.... Delhomme went to the Super Bowl with Carolina, Kitna's putting up excellent numbers (except last week vs Washington), and Jeff Garcia is the best stop-gap QB in football... I think a lot of things (40 times, etc) are overanalyzed and over valued when it comes to drafting players.... And, for QBs, I think height is one of them....
Right on both counts. The 65 Draft was actually held prior to the College football bowl season. I thought Namath was signed by the Jets prior to the NFL Draft but he was actually signed the day after the Orange Bowl in January and I think the 65 draft was actually held in November 64.
If I was using a 1-10 rating... I would probably give Clemens and 8... 9 would go to very strong armed QB's... 10 would be guys who simply have cannons... All that really matters though is can your QB put zip on the ball... Clemens proved he can do that...
I hate the guys size but he looks like he has an lightening quick release. When you hold the ball high with an over head motion and have a quick release you don't need lanes held so long. He also can move a bit so I don't see it as big an issue as it would be for a guy with a normal release.
Height will become even a bigger factor in the coming years as I pointed out before. Linemen are getting bigger and taller in every draft. If 6'2" passes today (and I don't think it does), it will never pass 5 years from now. You draft a franchise QB and hope he hangs around at least 10 years. By then 6'5" may be too small. That is why I don't see Clemens as this franchise's long term solution.
Actually that was the knock against him at the combine. He could not throw properly there. Anyone that had seen him throw when healthy said he has an above average to exceptional NFL arm. The reason for the concerns about arm strength was the fact he was limited at the combine. We all know how far combine commandos can move based on a few "measurables" He has an excellent arm by any measure.
That's been the established case since teams started copying the Cowboys OL approach in the early 90s. 6'7'' average O-linemen are not a new thing to the NFL, and nor is quarterbacks playing behind those O-lines being shorter than them. They are not a wall that can't be seen around.
You seem to be missing the point. I'm not trying to talk about the Jets here. Just name something (an actual thing, not a negative like "anything but . . . ") that you like and don't really have any complaints about.
Watching Kellens Baltimore game I have officialy forgiven Mcarrens for just one of those dropped passes. The ball was thrown so hard you see Mcarrens hands just simply come apart trying to hold on to it. The end zone drop is unforgivable! Id rate him a 9 not seeing more action from him!
Compared to my man Chad he has a rocket but in his own ranking its a "Strong Arm with a great release"
JMo if you were rating clemens arm from 1- 10 . I think it would fall somewhere between 6 and 7. Now the most important quality you must have, to go along with arm strength, is accuracy. Without accuracy really dosen't matter how good your arm strength is.
Clemens is not 6'2 that the Jets listed him at. He more close to 6'1 if I remember from the combines.(where they measure everyone) http://nflexperts.scout.com/2/509040.html
If so, then that's even more alarming. Just checked and of all the QBs in the league who you would consider start, only Favre and Romo are listed at 6'2". Everyone else is 6'4" or taller. Favre, of course is at the end of his career but it is interesting to see Romo at all 6'2". We will have to see how that affects him down the road. It may have contrinuted to his 5 picks against 3rd string players in the Buffalo game.
