I've been giving this some thought and I have to ask, does the acquisition of Moss, Stallworth and Welker really give New England a better corps than the Jets? I'm just not seeing it. More Big Play POTENTIAL...definitely. But for consistency over the course of a season? At the One Is Moss REALLY that much better than Coles? Yes he's more of a down the field threat, but we've already seen the fact that he gets nicked up easily (He doesnt miss many games but he doesnt catch as many balls...), and who knows what you are getting after that point. Remember he's not playing inside, on turf anymore... I might give a healthy edge to Moss, for week 1(or healthy for any given game....), but over the course of a Season????? Unless Moss returns to his ....2003....form, (at 30????) ....thats a wash at best..... also interesting to note, that after November 1, most of his better games came indoors. (which to be honest helps the Pats if they have to go play IN Indy.) At the 2. Stallworth/ Cotchery.... Between Stallworth and Cotchery is a very decisive speed mismatch, however, Cotchery caught 82 balls last year, (though for only 11.2 ypc) which is in the neighborhood of any 2 years of Stallworths production (2005 excepted.....) Another interesting note, is that when pressed into full time service, Stallworths YPC dropped to 13 ypc. If you look at his stats from last season (2006, Phi), he put up One huge game a month, then disappears for 3 weeks. And in those games, its generally one Huge play, and several average catches. Is there Potential there? Sure. However, Andy Reid certainly didnt think so, in fact he signed for NE for only 3.5 mil guaranteed, so if Philly wanted him, they could have kept him. Straight up, I'd take Cotchery. With the same caveat as above. For one Game, totally healthy, maybe Stallworth. For 16, It's clearly Cotchery. In fact both players Stallworth and Moss, , look like its hit or miss for one big hit a game, and in the case of Moss, the odds of that happening decrease GREATLY outdoors, in the second half of the season. At the 3. Welker/ Stuckey(or Jmac) This isn't even close. This guy took 3 years to get on the field. He's Wayne Chrebet, without the talent. Stuckey is Wayne Chrebet with footspeed. (Stuckey ran a sub 4.4 40 prior to breaking his foot.) Decided advantage to the Jets here. All that having been said, the X Factor is Brady, and the possibility that the Pats have retooled from their Weis brand of offense to something resembling Al Davis fondest dreams successfully. But I wouldn't be looking for the second coming of Bill Walsh's 49'ers . Comments? (Flame Suit is on...)
Your last comment is key. It is not the talent level at receiver that is the difference, it is the QB. As much as it pains me to say it, Tom Brady is light years better than Chad Pennington. If you gave Brady our receivers, he would be just as good (if not better) than with the ones he has. He is the reason they have been a great offense.
There you have it. I think your comparisons were pretty good, but Brady is the difference maker. If Brady had the Jets WR's I'd say they would be a lock for the SB this year. Not that they haven't done it before with lesser receivers, it's just that they would be that much better with a solid group like ours. In the WR's case though the real match up is between them and the DB's. If thats the case I think a decisive advantage goes to the Jets right now, and as Revis improves it will go further in favor of the Jets. Again though, WR's can't be productive unless the QB is getting them the ball. I think that will be a problem this year not only because of Pennington but also because of the O-line. Pennington supporters and detractors alike have to agree that he makes the field shorter then the typical starting QB. A good receiving core like ours suffers in certain respects because of it.
I do not believe the disparity between our quarterbacks is that great... it isn't neck and neck, but there is not a canyon between them either. I would give the biggest asset to NE would be the OL. When Brady can come in and produce under a line such as ours has been the last couple of years then I will be impressed.
I agree completely with your statement. And Hobbes, I see your points with Moss/Stallworth they are both pretty much unknowns at this point until we see how they fit into the system. I wouldn't sell Welker short though, this kid could play. They obviously overpaid for him, but he is a perfect fit in NE in my opinion. I love Stuckey and have been saying so since the selection but he has yet to do anything in the pros, and needs to prove he can stay healthy. The Jets better not sleep on Welker this weekend....
The NE WRs aren't necessarily better than the Jets but they don't play against our WR. They play against our secondary. And they are much improved over last season as a unit. I think Welker will have a huge year. He's going to eat people up in the slot with Moss and Stallworth dragging the secondary out.
Well, I still believe Randy Moss has been underrated due to playing for a terrible Raiders team, and I've never been a Culpepper fan either, where I believe Moss made him in Minny, not the other way around. If healthy, Moss >>> Coles. Cotch is a big question mark. Can he get it done? Time will tell. I'd lean toward yes if I had to give a guess, but it's just too early in his career to tell if he can be consistent. The third spot I'd agree we have a decided advantage. Putting in the part about Brady legitimizes the post. That's a HUGE equalizer. No matter what his receivers do, he's going to be a great QB, and will raise the play of the guys around him. While I still have hope that Chad can get the job done, the only player I'd rather see in a Jet uniform over Brady would be Peyton Manning. (Well, that's not true either, Tomlinson would be a dream come true.) The bigger key, over the course of the season IMO, is the rushing attack of both teams. Whoever runs the ball better this year is going to win the division.
It all depends on which Randy Moss shows up. If he can be even close to the player he was in Minnesota, that changes everything. If he is, it completely opens the field for the other receivers and yes, they would be a GREAT receiving corps. If he's the Moss we've seen for the last few seasons, I'd agree with just about everything you said. Unfortunately that was one area we were a lot better than the Pats last season and now they've AT LEAST drawn even or very close, if not pulled ahead. That's a scary thing considering who their QB is.
You have some great points, and for the most part I agree.. But Stuckey? Cmon dude. .He hasn't even played an NFL regular season down.. It doesn't matter how you get here, it matters that your here..
Good point Alio. In addition to that, I would say the Jets need to show that they can consistently stop the run, something NE can do in their sleep...
Until proven otherwise we are better at WR. I personally think Coles has had his bell rung one to many times and this is the year he isn't on the field the entire season. Your point that both Moss and Stolworth probably won't be either probably washes out. Welker is a guy on the rise and you can't say that either JMac or Stuckey at this point are better than he is since neither of them have that kind of pro production. He out produced JMac with Joey Harrington as his QB. He also had big time stats in college. This is his third year which is likely to be a break out year for him. You are highly under valueing him. This guy is way ahead of Cotch at the same time in their pro careers.
In all fairness, I think thats the ONE thing that separates Brady from Chad. Brady makes better throws under duress. Take that away (Though that is a key thing for qb's) and they are equal.
3 or 4 years ago, I would have agreed with you...but you are fooling yourself if you think this is true. CP has his strengths. Brady has the same strengths and much more. The line helps, but Brady deserves every accolade he is given. Now if you will excuse me, I need to go take a shower....I suddenly feel very dirty.
And Welker played one full season. You cant swap out Jmac for Stuckey and STILL get the same answer to the equation. I just believe Stuckey will be the better of the three.
Tomlinson Def. Brady....Probably. Manning never. (Maybe with Tom Moore and His entire cast...otherwise, never...)
And he produced for a terrible team with a crappy QB and OL. He was doubled most of the year on that team. You can ignore it if you want but this guy was a great pick up for the Pats. They over paid based on current value but 67 catches in his second year is a big time number.
*cough, hack, gag* I'm not saying Brady is not an elite QB (man, I hate saying that), just that I do believe that even with Penny's weaknesses he can be pretty dangerous QB. A good OL and a running attack and he will make few mistakes to lose a game. Yet, as Hobbes points out above, I would probably have to give him (Brady) the edge when it comes to operating under duress.
Thats not really true. Jmac put up superior numbers to Welker, in both 04, and 05. And one of those years was with Brooks Bollinger as his QB.
