You evaluate him seeing that he can't even make a accurate 2 yard pass, if you think Zach is fine you need a reality check.
of the 4 quarterbacks that we have on the roster, who gives us the best chance of taking us to the playoffs? Sadly, I think it's Flacco. F-me that's painful to admit. Does the CS & JD really believe ZW is the answer at this point? It's just a gut feeling, but, I think ZW will get the hook if he sucks early on against the Bears.
Fine as in a starting QB in the NFL. Fine as in he understands he played horrible. People are acting like he has no clue and thinks he played well. No way he does. He had a terrible day yesterday. No, that part was not fine. It was brutal.
I disagree. Our Defense is fucking stellar. Stellar. It may be better than 2009/2010. Our WR room is one of the best in the league. GW is a superstar in the making. Corey Davis is a solid #2 and both Mims and Moore are dangerous receivers with a ton of talent. Berrios is a luxury #5, probably the best #5 in the league. Our TE’s are both above avg guys that are getting open. Our running game is still a solid unit even losing Breece, and was stellar with Breece. Our OL unit has been decimated with injuries yet they are still playing at a high level. Put Herbert on this team and you bet your ass were competing for the SB. Put Garroppolo on this team and you bet your ass we’re in the mix.
I'm not a Zach rah rah guy and I did not at all favor drafting him at the time but I think I want to challenge this thesis that Zach should have been pulled yesterday. Obviously if we had it to do over now with 20/20 hindsight you'd rather go back and take a roll of the dice chance with Mike White in the 2nd half but in the heat of the moment as the game was unfolding I never really felt like benching him was what needed to be done. What needed to be done was Wilson needed to just hit a damn pass or two and get, if not a groove, then at least a little something going. Think back to if you were watching that game, Saleh benched Wilson at some point and then White came in and either fumbled a snap or threw a pick or something to just send things down the toilet. And after having no practice reps all week, cold, coming into something intense as that was yesterday chances are decent that might have happened. Then he'd (Saleh) really be getting killed today and things would be even worse. I'd strongly consider pulling Wilson now though. Call it an "in season break" or whatever spin you want to put on it. Make White the starter for say 3 games and just see what happens. He's all effed up at this point. I'm not QB mechanic expert but it doesn't take one to wince watching him falling backwards sidearming balls that sail over the target thats right in front of him. There was another brutal "zack attack" yesterday to I think Elijah Moore where he absolutely had him and just clanked the ball into the ground 10 yards in front of him.. My god. You just can't have that at the NFL level, especially on a team thats "ready" right now.
the only thing I like about Zack Wilson right now is that some idiot this offseason will think he can fix Zack Wilson and give us a late 1st or early 2nd for him. Than we can sign someone legit.
I have been a Zach doubter for 2 years and have mostly been in the middle of the argument arguing with both sides being critical of Zach the last 4 or so weeks. My issue with Zach hater posts is the process. They cherry pick stats, have only recognized one outcome and have been complete lunatics.They make up facts, don't watch film, don't cite sources and don't make sound arguments. One has to look at relevant data over time, look at trends and look at film. These people do not do that. They do not acknowledge the possibility of different outcomes and they do not make unemotional logical arguments. Their logic and critical thinking skills are severely compromised and this is where I take issue with their posts and for this reason their posts will always be wrong and the worst posts on this board. My issue with Zach is mental. He gets down, his confidence goes and everything falls apart. This is the reason most QBs fail and why I said all off-season it is likely he will fail. But, I also recognize his upside. When things click he has a very high upside. He played very well the last 7 games of last year and much better than this year where he has played 3 good games 3 awful games and one soso game. You can't have that in a QB. He has to be consistent. He might click and become good but the odds are really high against him. You can't keep losing confidence like this and falling apart every other game. IMO It will just get worse. The more things get bad the more things will fall apart. We could see it last week in his attacks on the media. He has shown resiliency in the past, coming back last year to put together 7 good games to close the season and to come back against Buffalo but how many times can he keep coming back. Even if he is does play ping pong good/bad each week I would argue at year 1.5 that is no longer acceptable. Consistency is what makes a good QB not highlight reel plays. Outside of a 9 game stretch of high level play from the last 7 games of last year and his first two this year we have seen no consistency. rather the wheels seem to be coming off mentally for him based on his comments, actions, play and reactions. That being said I recognize the arguments of Colrodaocontrails and Cval. Their arguments were intellectually vastly superior to the lunatic arguments by the haters. They made objective arguments based on evidence. They asked that we look at film and judge based on data over time. That is always superior to emotional gibberish based on ego. It matters little that Wilson will fail and we will have to watch another 1.5 years of it their posts and arguments are a thousand times better than the lunatics.
As the team said, we gotta see what Mike White is all about. In either situation Zach is here next year so let's get a QB battle going before we have more devastating losses and our defense loses their morale
A lot of true points here, he has mostly been a hindrance and the negative play is heavily outweighed the positive
Is he really a starting QB in the NFL though? I have had a super long leash with Zach, but enough is enough. Please go back and watch some of the clips I've posted throughout this thread + the one that was locked (it should be one of the lasts posts in the thread). He isn't even seeing guys running wide open down the field. His mechanics still suck ass and it's been 20 games. It isn't MLF anymore, he dumbed the offense down so much and guys are still streaking open with 3,4,or 5 yards of separation and he just misses them. He stinks. It's okay to accept it that we missed on the pick. The roster is good enough to win now and the defense is elite. If all we need is a game manager then it's time to make a change. We are currently getting (out of 33 qualified) Pass Rating 72.6 32nd Comp pct 55.6% 33rd Pass TD-INT 4-5 31st Pass TD/att 2.1% t-31st How is that FINE?
Someone is gonna have to send the G0lden Child a direct message that bluntly, his shit really does stink and he's not the second coming. Benching him yesterday, even for a series, would have been the smack across the mouth I think Zach needs. I think privately, QW, Sauce, GW, should have a private meeting no coaches present with Zach. Let the kid know this ain't a party and nobody really GAF how many stray MILFs he bangs on weekends. Zach got his ass kicked yesterday and acted like it was nothing. Time for the men on the team to show the kid nothing could be further from the truth.
It's not BB. If it is, it's actually worse, because this shows he is mentally weak, which can easily ruin a QB. But that's not it. There were a lot of wide open guys, he just missed them or didn't see them. In Buffalo game Zach took a step forward by being a decent game manager, after taking two steps backs against NE. This game Zach didn't just take 2 steps back, he probably took 3 steps. It's the same mistakes again and again and again. I thought he didn't learn from some mistakes because he didn't really pay a price for them before first NE game. Like airmailing TEs, etc.. But in NE game he did pay the price. And here he is again airmailing wide open Conklin for what should have been another easy pick. Zach is not learning from his mistakes, even though he already made them multiple times and paid big price for them. This has nothing to do with Belichick. Today MILF had a game plan where a lot of receivers were open. All Zach had to do is get 100 yards with all these open guys, and we win. Especially at the end, wide open Moore for the first down, which could win the game with just lousy 6 points. It's not Belichick, it's Zach I am afraid, and this is coming from someone who kept defending him up until this point, expecting a good game and a step forward yesterday. To get 3 steps back instead, we need to start thinking about plan B and plan C. White is next if Zach cannot step up vs the Bears, and if White sucks too, Streveler should get a look. Probably none of the QBs we have on the roster now are QBs of the future, but we need to pick the best one we have to compete for play-offs this year. Baring Zach's unlikely turnaround starting with the Bears, I think Streveler has the highest likelihood of stabilizing the offense for the season. I understand preseason against scrubs is not a great measuring stick, but he did better than White against the scrubs, and Zach and Flacco already lost us two games each.
Yeah 1000% And the lack of mea culpa after the game was horrendous. But there again... we didn't know that as things were hanging on a razor edge in the middle of the third quarter. Just speaking for myself as I hung on the edge of the seat watching that yesterday even as a Zach skeptic (not a Zach hater) I never ever personally felt like he should be pulled. I'd have pulled him for the Bills game and given him that week + the bye to regroup so I was wrong about that. And I'd pull him now and tell the world that the job is Mike Whites for X amount of time at least so the team can evaluate. Maybe 3 games? If Zach comes to Jesus and is killing it in practice etc and White goes 1-2 OK... maybe try again.
I like the idea of letting the Chosen One know his job is indeed in peril instead of the ridiculous passes Saleh is so fond of handing out. What's that old saying.. NFL = Not For Long
Mike T going around ESPN shows/radio today saying Saleh needs to make Zach the 3rd string QB this weekend or the locker room is toast.
Again, I don't mind seeing fans upset. That means the expectations are high. Zach did not reach them at all yesterday. No doubt about it. I am just saying I would not give up on him. Yeah, yesterday was alarming for sure. Those statistics are bad too. I saw some of those clips and they were more disappointing than losing the game. Sam had similar issues, which is not good. All I meant was he is fine to keep going as the Jets starting QB. At least this week. He is fine knowing he played bad too. No way he doesn't realize it. That is an honest and fair evaluation of yesterday. This is definitely a crossroads for Zach. He needs to step up and fast.
Actually you are asking me to defend my beliefs. And I did post several comments yesterday regarding Zach's performance, but I wasn't going to be engaged in serving up chum to the feeding frenzy. Also, I wanted some time to reflect before posting any more. With some reflection, here's where I am at this point: - Zach isn't playing like the #2 overall pick 2 years ago, let alone a potential FQB. Why? IDK. He has all the tools, so I'm baffled. There will be lots of psychobabble spouted no doubt, maybe some of it accurate. But it's clear that right now he's on the extreme verge of going from "QB of the Future" to "QB of the Past". - Regardless of the other reasons that affected his play, it's time he shoulders the blame like true leaders do when he doesn't perform. If he can't see that he's the central problem that's connected to the other problems, he needs to sit and watch from the sidelines for a while. There's no guarantee that this will "turn on the lightbulb" for him, but it's not lighting up on the field either. - I doubt that White, Flacco, or Streveler can carry the team to the playoffs, but if they can give Zach a chance for reset they have to be put in in place of him right now. - Looking at next year, I haven't looked at any of the college QBs, and don't plan to. The Jets clearly don't have any clue about how to develop a QB - including identifying the right one for their scheme - or being willing to adapt their scheme around him - as well as understanding the position at the NFL level and how to get a young QB to play at that level, so drafting a QB is pointless IMO. And the fan base has no patience for the process. Also, as damaged as he might be, I still think Zach has the potential to become a good NFL QB. As to that... - Ideally I would try to get Rodgers in for at least one year if not 2 (or 3 depending on his health and performance). Adding him to this rosters would make them SB contenders. And it would provide Zach with the perfect role model that he could learn from. It would be costly so maybe it's not possible, but up to a point it would be worth it. Rodgers seems to want out of GB, and coming to NY where he could polish his HOF resume and earn lots of money and the glory of turning the Jets into winners might be the right lure for him. I trust Douglas to make - or not make - this deal based upon what it would cost in terms of players/picks given up. If they can't get Rodgers, I'd try to get another vet who is clearly a successful starter to ensure that he plays and Zach sits and learns for a year or two. A "QB competition" would be a waste of time. If the guy they get clearly isn't better than Zach right ow, why bother? Those are my thoughts at this point.
