Ill stick my neck out against the grain & say that I really like Allen. He really made a lot of strides from his sophomore tape to junior..I know the stats say otherwise..but I liked the improved strength on drop backs,command of the offense,ability to make plays when things broke down & of course the arm strength. I wanted nothing to do with him prior to this season..but the improvements he showed really convinced me he's on an upward trend that w. his skill set makes him an attractive commodity. Wyoming is far from an easy place to play QB.The weather & surrounding cast are far from ideal.The coaches did him no favors w the scheme they ran.Very little in the way of high percentage throws..or in other words the throws everybody gives Big 12 QB's a hard time for inflating their completion percentage..every bit of that 56% was earned. Sometimes cold weather Quarterback play isn’t pretty..this guy is a cold weather QB through & through. For all the talk of him being unsuccessful, is Wyoming playing in Bowl games back to back years w.o Josh Allen? I venture to say no. First time they made back to back bowls since 87-88 It’s been reported he’s a great leader on & off the field w good intangibles to boot.i don’t know if x’s &o’s are an issue but that would make me pause no doubt..i haven't heard that anywhere other than here however. Studying his interviews he seems to hold back alittle bit of Football nerdboy when speaking publicly..thats usually a good sign about Football acumen. I'll take the guy that did more w. less & as a result has deflated stats over the State university golden boy who had a blue chip surrounding cast & therefore put up inflated stats. That's just me... And really for all the talk about the accuracy should we really be prioritizing some finesse dinker-dunker short/intermediate range QB for the swirling winds of Meadowlands & in the AFC East? I get accuracy is important but there's something to be said for a true cold weather QB strong w. good height scanning the field & throwing bombs 30+ yards down field w. ease through the erratic gust. That's a real compliment to the "run first" offense Bowles wants to put in place. Defense wants to put 9 in the box? Good luck. You find this kid acouple power forwards w. good catching radius & look out. He will still need to improve his accuracy for when teams play cloud or cover 3/4 but he'll have a whole year learning behind Mccown/Bridgewater which includes learning touch/better footwork. Meanwhile let the Vets play behind the suspect OL & we'll go into next draft w. a top 10 pick looking heavy at OL/Playmaker w. an eye toward trading down to recoup the 2nd rounder.FO/CS will have a whole year to figure out the exact right personnel to put around him as well as the right scheme to put in place. Makes alot of sense to me. But I understand others feel completely differently & would rather go w. a higher profile pro ready type..and I respect that.I like QB's who do more w. less..even if that means some negative stats/film to sort through.
Rosen was 0-6 on the road. Allen played well in the elements. if your argument is "success" then make your argument. How do you define success at the collegiate level?
Big difference as another poster stated, Jones played on a stacked Ohio State team, did you see this year's Senior Bowl?? I was skeptical about Allen, but watching him play against some of the best seniors convinced me that he can be a Big Ben/Wentz type...
Senior bowl usually tends to be a pretty good indicator for a QB's chances at the next level. There are a few duds like Jason Campbell, Christian Ponder & EJ Manuel..but look at the names of QB's who either raised or cemented their stock as 1st rounders w. solid performances at the senior bowl.. Chad Pennington David Carr Carson Palmer Phillip Rivers Jay Cutler Joe Flacco Carson Wentz --Non 1st rounders-- Russel Wilson Derek Carr Dak Prescott Not a bad place to start honing in on the nitty gritty of these QB evaluations.
I have to admit you've given me food for thought about Allen here, but I still think he needs much more work than the other top 3, and I don't think Macc has that much time to play with. Of course I could be completely wrong, and Macc sees the guy you described in your post and takes him. If he does, I sure hope you're right!
Dude, that’s an awful example. Again, in the NFL, that’s exactly where you want the ball to be placed to avoid a backwards pass, fumble situation. The RB ran that route horribly, if he would’ve faded into the flat, that’s a big gain. Look at the RB and the cushion he has there to the nearest unblocked receiver, if he fades into that, he hasn’t momentum and the opportunity to make the defender miss, most importantly, it’s not a fumble if it’s bobbled or behind him. Did you watch all three of those games or just look at the statline? Just curious. Not assuming, which is why I’m asking.
I don’t usually just post without something of relevance with topic. ....but dude. This was on point. I like you. That is all. Carry on. Ha
I don’t even think the giants are taking a qb! They are taking Barkley or Nelson from note dame. They have the WRs the te and they have fille some of their online problems they can fix online with Nelson or put best player in this draft Barkley in back field adding yrs to Eli’s career. And they have Webb to develop for a few yrs. Darnold is going one. Then we get what we want. Giants will not take a qb.
Hahahaha No he wasn’t. That fucking team was good. We were winning with Jones and JT for fuck sakes. Neither are quality QBs. I was hopeful but it was very obvious early on that these guys were fortunate to be on those teams. The scheme that Myers runs is tailored to hide those deficiencies with those QBs.
If he's more than a 1 year project..I'm with you..it's not gonna be a fit. But I think it's pretty well implied at this stage that whomever the rookie is will sit behind Mccown/bridgewater year 1. I don't think it matters which QB they take.This regime is very consistent that they believe in letting a young QB sit & learn before taking the reigns. I think that changes things a bit for Allen b.c he does have the immense upside & the ideal prototype for the meadowlands. If he needs a year on the bench I don't think that's prohibitive at this stage. If anything it's likely a blessing in disguise behind the current OL/surrounding cast. It's if he really does need multiple years that would cause pause in my estimation.
I agree. However, I think the transitions will be fairly smooth for him once he gets some NFL caliber talent around him. He will be a guy to elevate the play of others and will excel with that NFL talent around him. He’s never had that, yet, he has done some impressive things for Wyoming despite that lack of talent. That’s a credit to him. After watching a lot of his games from last year, he is making throws that you want an NFl QB to make. Consistently. So many drops though, poor routes, bad blocking, but the correct call placement is there. Just didn’t show on the statline. I love this guy as a FQB prospect. It’s Allen and Rosen for me. Allen gets the nod from me because of Rosen’s injury history.
I see your point about Macc and Bowles probably sitting the rookie for a year anyway, and I agree that Allen's physical skills are a great match for the Meadowlands/NY winter, but where I see a disconnect is his fitting into their WCO-type system with his accuracy issues. Now maybe that can be rationalized due to the weather he often played in, the poor OL and receivers, and the system not built to his strengths, MAYBE. But taking the weather first, you're arguing that Allen is made for the NY weather, and yet you're also saying that's a reason he wasn;t more accurate - it can't work both ways. On the Jets he won't have a great OL or receivers, at least right away, so there's no gain to be had there. And finally, the WCO system certainly isn't tailored to his strengths, so all of the main reasons he didn't do well in Wyoming will exist in NY. Again, you and others are more knowledgeable about QBs than I am, but I don't think I'm an idiot nor blind, and what I see is a kid who is a project, and that's something that Macc can't afford.
We're in complete lockstep. It's Rosen & Allen. Both have the necessary arm strength including down the seam, both show offensive command, both are strong in their drops & both largely did more w. less in college. I also agree that Allen may not even need a whole year. Surrounding him w. legit talent will go a long way as will gaining chemistry;He may not even have to learn better touch afterall. I think he could execute the "dumbed down" QB-on -A-chain gig that Bowles prefers for youngsters very well. He wont be able to make every throw right off the bat but you can give him 1 read/checkdown including deep throws n tell him not to force anything unless the situations begs for such & he'd do quite nicley w. a good running attack.He's still a threat w. throws over the top, can still hurt defenses w. his legs & his hard to bring down. Then in a year or 2 he's executing a high octane offense suited to his skillset.
So... you are trying to defllect. Just making sure. Because we were talking about Allen and then you started talking about Rosen. Who, by the way, I hate with a passion.
Ok who is deflecting now? You made a comment about Allens lack of success at QB. Define that. Agreed on Rosen.
But that wasn't the NFL. A QB's job isn't to zing the ball where Antonio Brown can catch it, it's to put it where his receivers can catch it. And I don't think he meant to lead his receiver that much. I watched the Boise State game, it was raining and his teammates weren't helping him much. But he was also missing his receivers and trying to play hero ball when it wasn't necessary. The question is whether he can re-work his playing style to be a consistently good passer in the NFL. And that's arguably the hardest thing to do.
I was making a point about evaluating a QB based on one game. Allen is way better than Cardale Jones.
