I dont know that any of these qbs are 1st round talent trult, but i guess thats all relative to the draft talent at the time isnt it? Unless they can geet Glennon for cheap, not interested in that either. Sent from my SM-G935V using Tapatalk
I agree that Hack is a complete mystery....will the Jets give up on him without even having him take a snap? Not common to just throw away a 2nd pick without knowing what you have. Petty has no trade value at this point - near a mystery as Hack. Better to play your hand at this time.
Man your playing with words. You want to judge and label a QB 'Franchise' based on his 1st year , and disavow calling snap judgement? And your basing your point about Sanchez on hindsight. Making him look better than he was?? Who knew that he was a failure waiting to happen after his 1st season? Did you? Then the Jets should hire you to run their operations.
Sanchez was a very successful QB in his first few seasons. He was on path to be a decent starter. Maybe not a star, but adequate. But then the Jets let his security blanket Braylon Edwards walk, he got concussed a few games, then got happy feet and it was a downward spiral from there. The Jets handled Mark Sanchez very poorly and thought he could carry a team when he most certainly couldnt.
Let me ask you...If you buy a purebred Labrador Retriever, is he a purebred, or does he have to get to a certain age and performance level to achieve that tag? In my terms, a potential FQB is a FQB - somebody you judge to have the qualities you're looking for in same. Whether they achieve that level of performance changes the potential tag to actual. That's how I evaluate QBs, you can use whatever system or terms you like. As for Sanchez, I was hopeful when he was drafted that he was a FQB, despite the doubts surrounding his lack of experience, but after his first season, yes, I knew he was not a FQB, but I did think that he was good enough to win them a championship with the right cast. The Jets didn't keep that cast that got them to 2 championship games with him around him, and the more he tried to make up for that loss, the more he struggled. If the Jets want to hire me, I'd listen to their offer.
There isn't much difference between pick #37 and pick #38. Please don't try to convince us that there is. Yes, one seeks to get the best value one can in the draft, but that isn't the be-all or end-all. Getting players you think have the potential to be good and hopefully filling needs is. In general, reaching is a terrible idea, but BB routinely does it and it usually works out for him. Yes, other positions do get picked as reliably clean as QB early in the draft. They are LT, CB, and pass rusher be it 4-3 DE or 3-4 OLB. When your team hasn't had a quality QB in forever, it's not realistic to say that a GM should wait and not take a QB in the 2nd round if it's not in the top 4 picks or so. They have to find a QB or their team doesn't win and they don't keep their job, no matter how good the rest of their team is. I doubt whether any GM is gonna think, "Wow, we really need a QB and I really like this QBs talent and intangibles, but odds are this guy isn't gonna succeed because he won't be great value at pick #40 in the 2nd round. I think I'll take an OG instead and hope that QB is still there in the 3rd or 4th round."
Teams have tended not to take QB picks in the high 30's lately. The last to do so was the Jets in 2013 who took Geno Smith, undoubtedly using the philosophy that you described of Mostly teams avoid the area though because it's clear the value in the pick is much greater anywhere but QB, since the QB's have been picked clean by that point. Yes, LT's can be picked clean by the 37. Yes, Edge Rushers can be picked clean by the 37. That still doesn't justify using that pick on a QB when a whole bunch of teams have told you that a QB is not in play that has appropriate value for the pick. Teams start jumping back into QB market at about pick 40 to 42. They still get stoned on value in that range. They keep picking through the 40's to the end of the round and they still get stoned on value. QB's picked in the latter part of the 2nd Round are among the least valuable players selected on those picks, based on what has happened going back to 1986. You do get All Pros at other positions out of the latter part of the 2nd Round but you *never* find a QB that meets that criteria. You rarely find a starter at all. Jimmy Garoppolo might change the line of reasoning a bit but even then he's one guy in 31 years and is likely just as unrepeatable a phenomenon as Tom Brady in the 6th or Russell Wilson in the 3rd. You can throw 25 latter 2nd Round picks against a wall and maybe come up with one star. It stands to reason that since people have succeeded outside of the 36 it is possible to do so. However the fact that if 25 guys walk into your camp one might turn into a star does not make it a good value proposition to take those 25 guys and nobody is smart enough to figure out which one will hit and which 24 are just a waste of time. In 2014 alone the 2nd Round WR's outside the 36 produced Davante Adams, Jordan Mathews, Allen Robinson and Jarvis Landry. The RB's produced Carlos Hyde and Jeremy Hill. That's real value on a 2nd Round pick. Nobody has gotten that kind of value outside the top 36 at QB since the Cardinals took Jake Plummer and for them he wasn't that kind of value - making good at the end of his career with the Broncos not with the team that spent the 42 pick on him.
The Jets let both of his security blankets go in sequence: Cotchery was the guy in 2009 and Edwards was the guy in 2010 and both were gone by 2011. Nothing like taking your QB's favorite 3rd down targets away to make him worse. The loss of Keller was big also and the deterioration of the OL happened all during the process. One year of turnstile at RT basically blew Sanchez confidence and that was the ballgame. The reason Sanchez failed was that he probably needed a high caliber personnel group around him to succeed. The reason he blew out was that the Jets offense kept developing holes in key areas as fast as they patched the last one. That happened because the Jets solution to holes on offense was to sign veteran free agents instead of finding and developing young players and the vets were good for one or two seasons on average not five seasons like a young homegrown star would have been.
Your right... The switch out of Cotchery for Holmes was a bad move by Tannenbaum. Sanchez trusted Cotchery. He didnt put up huge stats but could be counted on to get that critical third down catch late in the game. He was great at that. Santonio had a few good years but obviously didnt respect Sanchez and it led to some bad chemistry. A real shame...
How many third string (4th in reality), first year QBs get media coverage? They probably want another qb but might end up using petty. Who knows. They shouldn't really say much of anything until after the draft. Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk
I think we're side stepping the issue as to what constitutes a QB being labeled "Franchise". If I buy a pure bred Labrador, I know what I'm getting, there's no gamble in that. If I draft a QB in any round, It's a gamble/risk no matter what anyone says, scouting, etc.. Some become stars but most fall way short. You assumption that a QB drafted at top of the 1st round to be a 1st year starter is fine, but to label him FQB, that's a bit of a stretch. Labeling any one "Franchise" without proving his worth is open for debate....and in this years draft, it is much debated.
I'm not side-stepping anything. When you buy a purebred Lab, all that you know for sure is that its pedigree is good - you don't know whether it can hunt, or is gunshy, etc. - so there is a risk if you want a hunting dog, and not just a pet. Now, it could turn out to be a prize winning dog, and become your stud or bitch to produce many great offspring...in other words, a franchise dog. And if that was your intention when you first bought it, you would refer to it as your "franchise" dog, until it was proven or became apparent that it couldn't rise to that level. SO in that regard, the analogy stands.
It's pretty incredible that we just picked a QB in the 2nd round, gave him a redshirt year and he's barely an afterthought in fixing our gaping hole at the position. Kinda surreal really.
He's almost completely written off without having played a regular season down. Can't think of a better potential underdog story. Then again this is the Jets. Sent from my KIW-L24 using Tapatalk
i think this is a made up issue. i don't think qb is in the cards for us this year.(hurts because i like watson) i think mac wants to let this thought run wild so a qb or 2 go early dropping a player down to us or getting someone to come up to our pick. my prediction right now would be petty,hack and a jag with petty getting first crack.
This would be my hope, trade down, get some OL help, draft Njoku in the 2nd, a RB in the 3rd-5th rd, pick up Foles, Hoyer or Glennon whoever is cheapest with an easy to cut contract. Let Petty, Hack and the FA fight it out and if they aren't going to cut it just get ready for the 2018 QB class.
Yea thats basically where i am at too. i would include geno in that list too just for age and potential price tag.
