That is such a weird argument to make though, it almost makes no sense at all, especially when you look at that list. Practically every QB to win a SB was a 1st round selection. The part about "no debate about taking him" "can't miss" is just a matter of one's opinion, in this case, your opinion. Joe Flacco taken at no.18 overall or Ben Roethlisberger taken at no. 11 overall & winning SBs prove that teams that draft QBs in the top 10 aren't winning SBs unless it's a 'can't miss' prospect??? HUH? Doesn't it make more sense to say that teams in the top 10 should've taken Joe Flacco or Ben Roethlisberger or Aaron Rodgers, etc.. than worrying about them because they weren't 'cant miss' prospects? Or better yet- when you look at that list of SB winning QBs taken in the 1st round, doesn't it just make more sense to say that most great/SB winning QBs are taken early in the draft?
Yup, Brady is such an anomaly that you have to remove him from the discussion. It simply skews the results too far based on such an extreme outlier. _
Look at the teams that have been consistent winners over that period and the teams that have been consistent dregs over that time. The winners have the franchise guys year in and year out. And they consistently compete. The dregs have dregs for QBs and are consistently bottom of the barrel and are constantly looking for a QB. _
No, the point is to take the BPA on the 6 and not draft a QB who is not near that status. Mariota may well be the BPA on 6 after the Jets evaluate everybody. If he is then they should take him. If he's not they shouldn't. It's that simple. Lots of teams have taken a QB in the top 10 because they needed a QB. Since the merger only 3 QB's taken in the top 10 but not on the 1 pick have won a Super Bowl. Phil Simms drafted on the 7 in 1979 by the Giants. Jim McMahon drafted on the 5 in 1982 by the Bears. Trent Dilfer drafted on the 6 in 1994 by the Bucs won with the Ravens in 2000. That's a daunting list to look at given that we know Bill Parcells and Lawrence Taylor were the primary reasons the Giants won and the Bears and the Ravens both had all-time great defenses.
To answer your bolded question, the answer is YES. There's not a single QB that will be available in the draft in the next two years that can carry Marcus Mariota's jock.
I think what it says is that if you do not have a great defense there is no point in drafting a QB with that early 1st round pick unless he is a great can't miss prospect. He isn't going to put you over the top unless he's that kind of prospect. Better to take the great player than the very good QB even if you don't have a QB.
Two years ago Winston won the Heismann. He wasn't as good this past season, but still better than any of the other stiffs whose names I have seen mentioned for the next two drafts. Mariota had 4 great seasons. None of the stiffs will be able to match his consistency or collegiate career. If you think they can, you're just deluding yourself.
I highly doubt Mariota drops to #6. If he does, great but I'd concentrate efforts on BPA. What I'm looking for out of this new scouting team is what they do given who's available at the time and with undrafted players. If you're looking to for a possible prospect at QB that likely will be a late 7th rounder or not drafted they should look to someone like Tyler Heinicke, the guy won the Walter Payton award, he's very accurate but the question is arm strength. He reminds me a bit of a guy named Chad... and in this age where the deep threat takes a back seat to progression reading and accuracy he's a guy I want to see them thinking about at the end of the draft.
You have to be able to throw deep to make all the progression reading and accuracy pay off. Otherwise the defense stays in a nickel and has the FS up to help out. The Jets used to go deep with Chad a couple of times a game to keep opposing defenses honest. That worked fine until the shoulder injuries made the deep balls a real liability.
This is a digression from the discussion of Mariota, but imo I would be very surprised if Cb is not addressed in FA, in fact likely with two picked up, or at a minimum one with a safety picked up as well.
Agreed, but I think its more the threat of the deep ball to keep D honest. The QB doesn't have to be the mad bomber. A guy that is accurate and can go deep a few times a game is more valuable than a gun arm without accuracy.
Was 3 great seasons but even still, as a freshman Mariota was completing 68% of his passes with an ungodly TD-INT ratio. And he's been consistent all 3 years in those categories--mid to high 60% completion rate and incredible TD-INT ratio. Cook didn't play his freshman year and his last 2 full years he's been below 59% completion rate both years and while his TD-INT ratio is okay, he threw the same number of INTs in 2 years as Mariota in 3 years on 450 less attempts and his total TDs for 2 years is the same number Mariota threw in just one year. I don't even know why people talk about Hackenberg--he was brutal last year after a very pedestrian freshman year. And a below 59% completion guy. I'm much higher on Cook than Hackenberg and I''ll be watching both a lot this year. But neither of them have anywhere near the pedigree Mariota had heading into their final (likely for hack) year. _
Nope. Once the holes are plugged up and the team is solidified, THEN you trade picks and move up in the draft. Two seasons ago, at the beginning of the 2013 season, Jameis Winston hadn't even started a single game at FSU. Eric Manuel was the starter in 2012. Winston started as a Freshman and was the starter in 27 games over 2 seasons. So again, we don't even know who might be available in the 2017 draft, so it's illogical to say that there definitely won't be anyone as good as, or better than Mariota.
how many people have to say we don't care about Tebow lover's opinion of QBs before we stop hearing it.
Stokes- Perhaps it goes against logic, but I actually like to see QB prospects that struggle a little bit in college early on or even have games where they struggle from time to time. It shows me they can deal with getting through the shit and get better. Especially if they are coming to this NY Jets team With Mariota, the fact that he has all clean passing no.'s scares me a little. Especially since the college game has atrocious defense right now. I understand if that doesn't make any sense but its how I feel haha
No. Hopefully they will have improved enough that they would be drafting later. But, once the holes are plugged, THEN you look at moving up in the draft to take a good QB. Having stock piled picks from trading down could help with that.
Somehow I envision this new administration doing a fantastic job of putting together a competitive squad through the draft and FA (at FS, WR, OLB etc) but considering the options we have at qb we will be stuck with geno. And geno is going to be geno and fail mightily because he's simply not a good NFL football player. I want to be wrong but I doubt Winston/mariota are there at 6 and I wouldn't honestly want either as a day 1 starter. Hopefully I'm wrong
This is where you see players like a Jay Cutler. The only way the team plays well is if the QB makes no mistakes and carries the team. I'd highly encourage you to watch Penn State Football next season, observe Hackenberg for yourself because this seems like a guy you might be on board with. I see a lot of similarities back when Cutler was in college w/ Vandy. No talent, but still impressed plenty of scouts. No NFL talent around him on offense. Strong arm, good football IQ, good physical stature. Skill-sets translate to the next level.
That's fine but I think (actually read somewhere) that QBs that never complete more than 60% of passes ever in their college career have never gone on to be good pros. I think that may be a recent observation but if a guy can't his on more than 60% of his passes in COLLEGE, I'm not sure the NFL is where that number spikes up. Russell Wilson was always under 60% at NC State but when he got to the Big 10 he shot to over 70% Still, I'd really like to see Cook over 62-63% this year. _
Honest question, did you see anything out of Hackenberg that wowed you this year? I saw a bunch of his games and he looked brutal at times. I get the injuries and the lack of talent around him but he did not appear to me to be a good QB. He looks like a less athletic poor-man's Bortles to be quite frank. _
