New perspective on Geno's game against the Bills

Discussion in 'New York Jets' started by perpetualchange, Dec 15, 2014.

  1. nyjunc

    nyjunc 2008 TGG Bryan Cox "Most Argumentative" Award Winn

    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2002
    Messages:
    53,044
    Likes Received:
    1,434
    Buffalo has an outstanding D, they are a decent QB away from being a really dangerous team but that doesn't excuse Geno's performance against them.
     
    matt robinson 17 likes this.
  2. matt robinson 17

    matt robinson 17 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2002
    Messages:
    21,158
    Likes Received:
    8,027
    That pass rush is amazing
     
  3. nyjunc

    nyjunc 2008 TGG Bryan Cox "Most Argumentative" Award Winn

    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2002
    Messages:
    53,044
    Likes Received:
    1,434
    You can have a bad game against them, you can't look like you don't even want to compete and that is what Geno did.
     
    matt robinson 17 likes this.
  4. Clark Gaines

    Clark Gaines Banned

    Joined:
    Aug 29, 2005
    Messages:
    1,262
    Likes Received:
    189
    One thing about Geno's performances: he hasn't been helped by the fact the Jets so rarely attempt to stretch the field. If the defense knows it doesn't have to cover deep, it won't. And I understand that the probability of success on those deep throws is less than desirable, but you have to attempt them more than once per game. And you have to call it early. Geno's had his share of fuckups and shown an immaturity in some instances, but the playcalling has been sub-optimal, based on lack of speed outside and lack of pass protection up front. Those deficiencies have to be addressed no matter who is under center.
     
    LIJetsFan likes this.
  5. perpetualchange

    perpetualchange Active Member

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2013
    Messages:
    138
    Likes Received:
    50
    How did Sanchez "manage" the game? Never really understood that. He's typically made some pretty bad decision managing the clock when it was up to him.
     
    TwoHeadedMonster and LIJetsFan like this.
  6. legler82

    legler82 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2006
    Messages:
    13,399
    Likes Received:
    7,334
    The Bills GM, whoever he is, had a terrific off-season.
     
    LIJetsFan likes this.
  7. nyjunc

    nyjunc 2008 TGG Bryan Cox "Most Argumentative" Award Winn

    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2002
    Messages:
    53,044
    Likes Received:
    1,434
    except at QB which will keep them out of the playoffs.
     
  8. legler82

    legler82 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2006
    Messages:
    13,399
    Likes Received:
    7,334
    E.J. still has a shot at being their future.
     
  9. Noam

    Noam Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2010
    Messages:
    5,383
    Likes Received:
    7,441
    What you say are good points but I do think Geno has regressed quite a bit and its in the most important area for a QB, the area of mental toughness. Last year he was brutalized more than any Jet QB since O'Brien. But he kept getting up. After game 4 with a few note-able exceptions (4th quarter of Pitt game and 8 quarters following the 1st quarter hit in Buffalo) he had very good pocket presence, stepped up in the pocket and followed through on his throws. Not panicking and not displaying Sanchez like happy feet. But this year starting with the Detroit game he started shuffling his feet in the pocket, becoming indecisive, stopped stepping up in the pocket, stopped stepping into throws, and started panicking. There are many valid excuses for his breakdown but the bottomline is he mentally broke down on and off the field. I don't think that is the type of QB that is a long term prospect. Yes, when he is not rushed and has time in the pocket he throws an accurate and beautiful ball. Something we have not seen in quite a long time. When he has time his confidence goes up and he is a much more decisive and better QB. He can make plays with his legs and inspire the team with his team running. But I can't ignore the mental break downs this year. The happy feet in the pocket. The indecisiveness and panicking. He may not be anywhere near as bad as Sanchez was here but I don't think a QB can survive and play at a high level in NY without mental toughness and this year he has shown he is not mentally ready to overcome the obstacles a NY QB has to deal with. Give him a year or two on the bench to study and rejuvenate some confidence and he could be a much better QB but I just do not see him making it in NY.
     
    #29 Noam, Dec 15, 2014
    Last edited: Dec 15, 2014
    Axel3419 and Clark Gaines like this.
  10. pclfan

    pclfan Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2013
    Messages:
    5,223
    Likes Received:
    1,053
    I was thinking the same thing. Not sure if they have the consistency and can deal with adversity in a game. But they can beat anybody.
     
  11. irishwhip03

    irishwhip03 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2014
    Messages:
    4,581
    Likes Received:
    1,962
    Broncos did move the ball against the Bills..CJ Anderson had 3 TDs from less than 6 yards out. Those scores could've easily went to WR's.

    As for the Pack. The Bills dominated them. But I think I heard their guys had 8 drops. Thats a huge amount. And Jordy dropped a for sure 90 yard TD.

    The numbers look off but the actual way the games went tell a slightly different story to me.

    Either way they were able to make 2 of the best QB's in the league look average..the same way they made a bad QB look horrible.
     
  12. BomberJet

    BomberJet Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2002
    Messages:
    2,113
    Likes Received:
    1,123
    The reason why we don't is because of the results from Geno's play the first 12 games of last year. If I recall, the CS decided at about week 13 to have Geno do pretty much all shot gun. Previous, he was making poor reads under center. This is one of the reason's why Geno finished on a high note in 2013.

    This year, it's anyone's guess as to why Geno has played so poorly. His decision making is one very key factor. That usually takes many, many snaps for a QB to experience to get with the 'program'. The question remains is that, if Geno can make these corrections and show the fans and CS something , in the not too distant future.
     
  13. BrowningNagle

    BrowningNagle Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2003
    Messages:
    28,048
    Likes Received:
    29,302
    What about stealing Schwartz away from them to become the next HC here?

    1)The guy took Detroit from 0-16 to the playoffs
    2)Has taken this Buffalo defense to the next level
    3)has HC experience that he can learn from.
    4) has always had players that played hard for him. A nice mix of a player's coach/disciplinarian
    5) his 4-3 defense would work great with this personnel
    6) His hire would significantly hurt a division rival

    There are cons to his hiring sure - but he's worth an interview
     
  14. JetsVilma28

    JetsVilma28 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2005
    Messages:
    8,917
    Likes Received:
    2,023
    Morningwhig is a far bigger problem on offense than Geno IMO. I don't know if Morningwhig makes adjustments throughout the game. Early in the season Johnson looked like he was struggling while Ivory seemed fine and when Powell was given opportunities he was picking up big yards. Why keep popping Johnson if Ivory and Powell are playing better?

    If I was OC I would never let Geno throw the ball 30x a game, never. At most it would be in the 20-25 range. I don't trust him with the football, I don't trust his decision making. I don't trust the offensive line.

    My offense would be similar to Pennington-Martin. Heavy run, counters and traps, pulling guards, quick pass 3 step slants, picks, outs and ups. The bombs would come from PA which would be supported by the heavy run attack. The key would be Geno or who ever was playing QB to sell the fake like Pennington use to. Make the ball disappear so if your opponent on defense loses sight for even just a split second, just a hint of hesitation for run you know have them beat over the top. Pennington never had the arm for it, but boy could he fake the lights out.

    If Geno had any ball faking skills from center, with our running attack the way it looked coming into the season, Geno should have been able to buy just the right amount of time to gain receiver separation and hit big plays. All the quick passes would be 3 step, if it's not there 1st read pump, 2nd read pump then you are running, throwing out of bounds or eating it. The 'pocket' has been pretty pathetic since '11.
     
    LIJetsFan likes this.
  15. Clark Gaines

    Clark Gaines Banned

    Joined:
    Aug 29, 2005
    Messages:
    1,262
    Likes Received:
    189
    "My offense would be similar to Pennington-Martin. Heavy run, counters and traps, pulling guards, quick pass 3 step slants, picks, outs and ups."

    Which is the area that most pick sixes occur in: the short- to intermediate-range passes. Geno's defense reading has been poor, but the fact that the entire field isn't threatened is a large part of why he hasn't been successful.

    Case in point, a couple of games ago, Harvin caught a bomb on a back-shoulder throw from Smith. In truth, it probably was underthrown, but Harvin was able to make the adjustment and make the catch for a TD. Did they throw long the rest of the game? NO. So, of course, the defense didn't have to worry about that part of the field and could concentrate without worry of being threatened deep on plays in front it it the entire game.

    The Jets receivers don't win enough one-on-one matchups and the Jets offensive line can neither run block nor pass block consistently. NO QB is going to overcome that for any lengthy period of time. Vick couldn't do it, Sanchez couldn't do it; Smith can't do it. They need to shore up the surrounding cast for any QB to be successful.
     
    dgiven91 and LIJetsFan like this.
  16. feldspar

    feldspar Member

    Joined:
    Jun 1, 2012
    Messages:
    466
    Likes Received:
    17
    This wasn't as bad as you make it sound. The Bills TRADED DOWN with the Rams to draft EJ Manuel. To trade up for the Bills pick, the Rams gave the Bills their second round pick, which turned out to be Kiko Alonso...the Bills also got a 7th round pick who has seen playing time.

    In effect, the Bills got Alonso and Manuel with the same pick. Yeah, Alonso got hurt this year, but he seems worthy of a first round pick alone based on what he did as a rookie.

    The Bills probably gave up too much to get Watkins...especially without a QB, like you say. But the Bills wouldn't be in a position to draft a top QB in 2015 anyway...not sure how many are worth getting in next year's draft in the first place. That's what that team needs, and not much else. Some o-line help and possibly RB or upgrade on TE.

    Jets fans know how hard it is to get a franchise QB. It's not like you can invent one and have him be available to you. Once you have that, everyone else looks better, for the most part.

    If Sammy is a really good player, then who is to say if the Bills made the wrong move? First round picks bust-out all the time. We'll never know what would have otherwise happened had they not traded up. Look at what happened with Julio Jones. The Falcons used FIVE draft picks to get him: 2 firsts, a second, and 2 fourths. I'd rather have Julio Jones than ALL the players Cleveland picked that they got from the Falcons in this trade. Only one player remains on the Browns they got through the Jones trade, even though it happened fairly recently.

    Again, include Kiko Alonso. It's Sammy Watkins AND Kiko Alonso...you also left off EJ Manuel too for some strange reason. He somehow doesn't count? There are three players there regardless.

    And the Bills have depth too.

    The two players that perhaps helped the Bills beat the Packers the most this week were castoffs from bad teams who have only been on the Bills for a matter of short weeks. Marcus Thigpen returned a punt for like 80-yards, the only TD the Bills scored. Bacarri Rambo intercepted Aaron Rodgers TWICE...Rodgers had only thrown 3 INTs through 13 weeks before that. Bringing in Orton was also a good move, as he's an upgrade to Manuel at least. I think that Doug Whaley, the Bills GM, may have a nose for talent. Time will tell.
     
    Bills over Jets likes this.
  17. Pocket Jet

    Pocket Jet Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 8, 2011
    Messages:
    1,138
    Likes Received:
    511
    My thought on Geno: HE SUCKS - does not matter who we have played or will play.
     
    TwoHeadedMonster and FlaJet like this.
  18. Zach

    Zach Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 8, 2002
    Messages:
    9,490
    Likes Received:
    2,302
    A fully upgraded donkey is still a donkey. [And this donkey isn't even there yet either.]

    And you just don't win the Kentucky Derby on a fucking donkey.
     
    FlaJet likes this.
  19. FlaJet

    FlaJet Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 8, 2003
    Messages:
    2,014
    Likes Received:
    1,020
    A game manager is a quarterback that is not expected to produce a lot of yards and points for the offense. He is not the best quarterback in the league, but the team is good enough to win due to a great running game or defense. He will be expected to make short passes and not turn the ball over, allowing the team to make long, time consuming drives. This just about describes Sanchez. Not so much Geno..JMO
     
  20. bnots13

    bnots13 Active Member

    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2013
    Messages:
    125
    Likes Received:
    42
    If Geno starts a game next season...I'm out.
     

Share This Page