I read plenty of different news sources, not just the US ones. Also, I happened to have friends who lived there, so please stop spreading this Russian propaganda. I can get plenty of it on CNN.com/Yahoo News, reading the comments.
You have yet to post anything resembling a legitimate article to corroborate your posts. Neo-nazis may have been involved in some of the protests and Nuland does say so but she also reiterates that the majority of the protesters were peaceful. I find it funny that the articles that I read, that push some kind of Neo-Nazi link, also have articles stating a Spanish air traffic controller claimed Ukraine military shot down the plane, but they also have this on the article. So they know it was a fake yet they keep the article up. That sure makes me confident that the claims in the articles are legit.
Yeah! They're all American. And it's not "Russian" propaganda. I'm reading multiple sources. I don't know who caused this but the Russian army isn't there. Those are Ukranians fighting their own (neo-Nazi) government in Crimea. Everyone calls them Russians and they speak and were a part of Russia before Ukraine gained its independence. To say "Russia" did this is categorically false and a common myth perpetrated by the US. Who within Ukraine did it is the question. Your statement about friend being there is kinda weak. If so, what are they saying? Are they really claiming that Russian propaganda is taking place? If so, what is it? Russia is calling for an international independent inspection. Again, Russia has nothing to gain from this. Those who are trying to control Ukraine are. But to say I'm surprised by such a response would be wrong of me. If you simply listen to US news, you are brainwashed into believing one view and one view only. Hollywood further molds American minds into believing Russia and Putin are evil and that's the extent of majority America thinking. Which side has kept bases intact in Italy and Germany since WWII? Which side has built up hundreds of bases in Iraq, Afghanistan and countless others throughout the Middle East as well as the far east in Japan and Korea? Everyone is "afraid" of Russia taking over countries when their only major conflict was in Afghanistan where they completely withdrew. Then there's the conflicts in Syria, Libya, Somalia among others - who was involved in those conflicts? And Russia is this so-called war-mongerer? That's what our media is pushing.
Pro Russian separatist utilizing Russian equipment and Russian training to fire Russian surface to air missile at civilian passenger carrier with 298 innocent souls onboard. Than, speculation of the pro Russian separatist hiding the equipment back in Russia. Not to mention, speculation of a Russian Major confirming with a pro Russian separatist that a civilian plane has been shot out of the sky by a pro Russian separatist missile that was given to them by the Russians with Russian training. "Russia" has nothing to do with this lol
It was Ukraine. Of course they are pro-Russian separatists. But they are Ukranian citizens. Where's the Russian army or government? Explain. Ukraine builds the BUK-300. That's not proof of anything. Ask about why Ukraine dispatched the flight to move over that region. Ask why they haven't demanded an investigation (required by law) thereby leaving bodies to rot for 3 days and counting. Ahh, but evil Russia did it. Where's the smoking gun even? And again, explain the benefit to Russia. But hey, believe what you want.
That's good of them since the rest of the world has been asking the same question. There was no threat of aircraft so why was this needed?
Just wondering which "official story" everyone will settle on. Like,how do you decide in the end,which story finally puts you to bed.
Most sane people realize what's going on in Ukraine. So far two conspiracy loving individuals here seem to be the only ones buying Putin bullshit. Makes sense since they love believing in crack pot things. Do people love to look dumb and be always wrong?
Putin paid a large sum to Yanykovich. 2 weeks after this payment former Ukr govt changed their long term commitment to join EU and declared pending alliance with Moscow.
The Russian sepratist would never claim to be Ukranian...? They are Russian, they claim to be a part of Russia. The Russian army is back and forth on the border of Ukraine. The Russian govt is certainly supplying the Sepratist rebels with equipment and now possibly trained personnel. We know tanks entered Ukraine from Russia. We know Chechnyan mercenaries entered Ukraine from Russia. The sepratist have no flying vehicles in their arsenal, but apparently they do possess weaponry and wherewithal to shoot some down. We also know there was communication between "Major" (Russian officer) and "Greek" (pro Russian seperatist) that a civilian plane was shot down by a missile. "A fuck up." I have no idea who produces/ed the Buk-300 I heard on the news (us news) 50 other planes flew the same flight path that day. Also, someone else on here stated that the flight path was cleared over a known battlefield bc the only weapons thought to be available were avenger type shoulder fired missiles which are unable to reach an altitude where mh17 would have been cruising at. I did think that was still a dumb decision to fly over known battlefield in an earlier post. I don't believe there is any benefit to Russia which is why they seem to be working so hard to cover their tracks. This is a monumental blunder to Russia for the men they are supporting on the ground in Ukraine. Imagine... you are wrong for a second and the plane was shot down by pro Russian sepratist supported by Russia. Yeah...Russia looks pretty fucking "evil" right now. Russia looks bad here anyway you try to spin it. It's not like they didn't illegally annex the Crimea only a few months ago. They have been stirring the pot in Ukraine, instigating war; and now look directly responsible; or at least a major part of where the fault lies for this atrocity. Actually, for the first time it looks like USA has almost nothing to do with this other than that one of our civilians were sadly onboard mh17. The world would like a proper investigation conducted but it sounds like "drunken" pro Russian seperatist are doing their best to prevent a "proper" investigation from happening. Instead, personal effects have been rifled through, stolen while the rightful owners rot and the families mourn.
The latter. Starting about 12 years ago The house on Lubyanka started systematic web infiltration. This included presence on various web forums. The methods varies from info overflow - making outlandish claim and then demanding proof to the contrary, to gathering personal info of opponents and ratting them out to their bosses ("he posted during work hours").
What do you guage right on? what you see on tv? you really don't have any right to speak of anyone belief if media is all you have,nor do I. its all lies
Ok, I'll go step by step.... very slowly. Those are Ukranians fighting their own (neo-Nazi) government in Crimea. We're talking about Donetsk here, not Crimea. You seem to be all over the place with very little substance. Do you even know the difference between Donetsk and Crimea? The neo-Nazi government you say? Here are the results of the last Ukrainian presidential election: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ukrainian_presidential_election,_2014 The ultra nationalist candidates, who you may call neo-Nazis if you want even though they are not, are Dmytro Yarosh and Oleh Tyahnybok - combined for less than 2% of votes. The parliament of the Ukraine: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Verkhovna_Rada The Svoboda party led by the above mentioned Oleh Tyahnybok has 7.9% there. So what neo-Nazi government are you talking about? Now, let's talk about these "rebels." The so-called Donetsk People's Republic (the separatists) is led by Alexander Borodai, who's a Russian citizen. Their military commander is Igor Girkin, a former FSB colonel from Moscow. He retired/resigned from the FSB in March of 2013. So, what do we have here? A supposedly local military force who happened to be led by two Russian citizens. I am sure there are some locals there as well, but the majority of those fighters are Russian/Chechen mercenaries who have gone through the Chechen wars and who knows what else. So, yeah Russia is not involved Again, Russia has nothing to gain from this. I don't even know where to start here. When the former Ukrainian president (a criminal with two convictions for robbery and assault) was overthrown, Russia lost one of their few remaining allies. They responded by taking over Crimea, making it look like they were protecting Russian-speaking people there. In reality, they just did not want to lose Sevastopol, the base of the Black Sea fleet, among other things. Now they are going even further, trying to destabilize the Ukraine as much as they can. They don't need the Ukraine to be part of the EU and/or joining NATO, as that would be Russia's worst nightmare. So, please stop spreading your lies. Thank you.
Two sides fighting... Ukraine vs Putins rebels... Ukraine has jets and Putins rebels have no flying ability what so ever. Ukraine has no need for anti air weaponry while the rebels do and have taken down a couple of ukraines jets and have bragged about taking one down and then recanting when it was a passenger jet instead.
its strange how people will put so much energy into a who-did-what in distat situation like this. one wher there is o chane I hell you ever know the truth,but you don't have the energy to be concerned about the ongoing impact of Fukushima. Its still an assumption,based on a notoriously biased US viewpoint. I'm not just talking about this situation,I'm talking about all situations. News is bought ad sold. As are a lot of conspiracy "theorys". Byt he time it hits any of our ears or eyes,its been diluted and laced. That is why having your own opinion is ok,but don't down someone else as a "crack pot" just because they don't buy their news cut with baking powder. If you don't realize that every major news source is nothing more than a business,then...
The crackpot point of views are so outlandish that these are easily debunked with a few minutes of research as Petro has done. Conspiracy theories such as fake moon landings, 9/11 truthers, birthers, etc deserve such scorn. In this case, there are two sides....Ukraine and Putin's rebels. From my own opinion, I've formed a best case theory that Putin's rebels shot down the passenger jet. There is alot of evidence out there (recordings, social media posts, a missile system going back to Russia, the region) that leads me to his conclusion.
That's complete BS,and at this point it makes more sense to think that the official 9/11 story is bullshit,than it does to to still accept it. People are bullied into accepting things that would rival some of the most ficticious writers ever known as truth. Unfortunately,most people don't undertand who really rules their planet. As far as this situation in the Ukraine,i feel bad for the families involved,but beyond that I don't really give a shit. I care more about the Fukushima cover up and things that will fuck us all in about 15-17 years
Modern journalism is nothing more than an arm of the entertainment industry. And journalists in general, with some exceptions, are notoriously lazy creatures. They'll report what's fed to them if it makes their job easier. So you are right to be skeptical. On the other hand, if you approach all information with the idea that its been "diluted and laced" before it reaches you, then you basically can't form a supportable opinion on anything. So every outlandish statement has equal credibility. I'm not saying I'm buying the official US position hook line and sinker like dopey is, but its not like there is a glaringly obvious alternative to hang your hat on.
please explain how it makes more sense to think the official 911 story is bullshit than it does to accept it.
