Comp Picks - Pt. 1

Discussion in 'New York Jets' started by NCJetsfan, Feb 8, 2014.

  1. NCJetsfan

    NCJetsfan Well-Known Member

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    If the following article is correct, it looks like the Jets will receive 4 comp picks - one 5th round pick and three sixth round picks.

    http://www.philly.com/philly/blogs/red_zone/2014-NFL-compensatory-pick-projections.html

    2014 NFL compensatory pick projections

    Jimmy Kempski, Philly.com
    Posted: Friday, February 7, 2014, 2:22 PM

    Over the last 2 years, my friend Craig Turner has done compensatory pick projections very accurately for my former football blog. Last year, he correctly matched 24 teams with the correct round for which they received a pick. He projected an additional 5 teams to receive a pick, but missed by just one round. The 3 remaining picks he missed on were due to some gray area, which he learns from every year.

    Since the NFL does not make the compensatory pick formula public, learning how to accurately project them for the entire league takes time and practice. Projecting comp picks is fairly complicated, and we'll go deeper into the methodology of projecting them later in the post. For a very basic (and slightly inaccurate) explaination of what compensatory picks are, you can check out the Wikipedia page on them here.

    Compensatory picks are typically announced at the NFL owners' meetings, which occur this year from March 23-26.

    First, for those of you who don't care at all about the methodology, let's just show the projections. From this point on, all the work shown was provided by Craig:

    Compensatory Picks Awarded (round – team – player lost)

    Read more at http://www.philly.com/philly/blogs/...ory-pick-projections.html#DWzMP0hGcgqODMyi.99

    3 – Pittsburgh – Mike Wallace

    3 – Green Bay – Greg Jennings

    4 – San Francisco – Dashon Goldson

    4 – Baltimore – Paul Kruger

    4 – Detroit – Gosder Cherilus

    4 – Baltimore – Dannell Ellerbe

    5 – Houston – Connor Barwin

    5 – New York Jets – LaRon Landry

    5 – Baltimore – Carey Williams

    5 – Atlanta – Brent Grimes

    5 – Pittsburgh – Keenan Lewis

    5 – New York Giants – Martellus Bennett

    5 – Baltimore – Ed Reed

    5 – Houston – Glover Quin

    6 – New York Jets – Mike DeVito

    6 – Green Bay – Erik Walden

    6 – New York Jets – Dustin Keller

    6 – New England – Patrick Chung

    6 – Cincinnati – Manny Lawson

    6 – St. Louis – Brandon Gibson

    6 – New York Jets – Shonn Greene

    7 – St. Louis – Bradley Fletcher

    7 – Dallas – Mike Jenkins

    7 – Cincinnati – Pat Sims

    7 – St. Louis – Craig Dahl

    7 – St. Louis – Rob Turner

    7 – Dallas – Victor Butler

    7 – Cincinnati – Brad Gradkowski

    7 – Tampa Bay – Geno Hayes

    7 – Atlanta – Will Svitek

    7 – Atlanta – Christopher Owens

    7 – San Diego – Shaun Phillips

    7 – Dallas – Kenyon Coleman

    7 – Houston – Donnie Jones

    7 – Atlanta – Luke McCown

    7 – Pittsburgh – Ryan Mundy

    7 – Buffalo – net value

    7 – Oakland – net value
     
    #1 NCJetsfan, Feb 8, 2014
    Last edited: Feb 8, 2014
  2. NCJetsfan

    NCJetsfan Well-Known Member

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    Comp Picks - Pt. 2

    Methodology (Warning: Extreme nerdliness lies below)

    I will once again give credit to AdamJT13 for his blog, adamjt13.blogspot.com, which provides the most comprehensive guide to comp pick rules available. Without his work, these predictions would not be possible. If you are unfamiliar with the basic rules that affect comp picks, they are:

    1. Lost players that are cut or not tendered as RFAs and ERFAs do not qualify.

    2. Lost players that were picked up during the season the year before do not qualify.

    3. Signed players that are released before midseason do not qualify.

    4. Players earning low minimum salaries do not qualify.

    5. Each player signed cancels out one player lost.

    6. The round of the pick awarded is primarily determined by the annual value of the contract signed. Signed players cancel out lost players with equal contracts, then lower contracts, before canceling out higher contracts.

    It should be noted that although the NFL admits publicly the basic rules above, NFL teams do not know the exact picks that they will be awarded. They have to make assumptions based upon past history, just as I have done.

    This is the first year I can report that I was able to find all contract values. Yay internet! This incorporates two new items that we learned last year; that the rights to comp picks accompany the trade of a qualifying player, and that the system under the new CBA will continue to qualify players at lower salaries than it had previously done. This year I will hopefully learn another new piece to the puzzle. If a team loses four guys with 7th round value, but signs three guys with 7th round value, for which player is the comp pick awarded? This situation happened in a few cases this year, and with no reference point to work from, I assumed that the comp pick would be awarded for the lowest lost player’s salary. An error in this assumption would have the greatest potential effect on Pittsburgh, which could jump ten places in the 7th round if the highest-salaried lost player is used.

    The order of picks in each round is based upon contract amount and playing time (number of snaps). AdamJT13 came up with a playing time equation, but he did not make it public, so I am just guessing here based upon recent history. I claim no accuracy on draft order within each round.

    I awarded 36 normal comp picks this year. This is the most picks awarded in a long time, reflecting a lot of player movement, which may be a result of teams unable to sign their own free agents due to salary cap restrictions.

    Isaac Sopoaga, who was signed from San Francisco by Philadelphia, and then traded to New England, affected the San Francisco and New England calculations. This was based upon how Drew Stanton (signed by the Jets from the Lions, and then traded to the Colts) was treated last year by the NFL.

    Last year Phillip Wheeler was a qualifying player on his $715,000 salary after playing more than 1,000 snaps. This year I counted all players in the $700k-$800k range that played a significant number of snaps. The players I am least certain on are Mike Pollak, who was signed for $780,000 and played 68 snaps, and Luke McCown, who was signed for $840,000 and played 16 snaps. I used Washington's signing of Keyaron Fox in 2011 as the relevant history in this instance to count McCown. Atlanta also has two players with “voidable” contracts so their predictions could turn into a complete mess; more detail is provided later.

    Four teams were given the maximum number of four comp picks: Atlanta, Jets, Baltimore, and St. Louis. None of them would have had a fifth pick if it was allowed. Third round picks are fairly rare, therefore the cut-off point for them is not easily decipherable. There is a possibility Green Bay’s comp pick for losing Greg Jennings will be a 4th rounder.

    I awarded 2 net value picks at the end (value difference between players lost and signed when the number of players in both categories is equal). Buffalo lost Andy Levitre to a large contract from Tennessee. Oakland lost and signed a large number of players, but the only large contract went to Desmond Bryant, who was signed away by Cleveland. Usually after the net value picks there are a few picks left. The NFL awards a minimum of 32 comp picks each year. Following the net value picks, the NFL will award picks to teams as if there were an 8th round, until the minimum of 32 has been reached. That did not happen this year because 38 picks were awarded through the normal methods.
     
  3. NCJetsfan

    NCJetsfan Well-Known Member

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    Comp Picks - Pt. 3

    Various team explainations

    For the purpose of not making this exercise longer than it already is, there are no explanations for teams that did not get projected comp picks.

    Atlanta
    Lost: Grimes ($5.5m), V. Walker ($2m), Svitek ($1m), Owens ($1m), L. McCown ($840k), Sidbury ($780k – IR no snaps)*
    Signed: Umenyiora ($4.25m)*, S. Jackson ($4m)

    Baltimore
    Lost: Kruger ($8.1m), Ellerbe ($7m), C. Williams ($5.7m), Reed ($5m)
    Signed: None

    Buffalo
    Lost: Levitre ($7.8m), Rinehart ($1.75m)
    Signed: Lawson ($3m), Branch ($3m)

    Cincinnati
    Lost: Lawson ($3m), Skuta ($1.5m), Sims ($1.5m), Gradkowski ($1.3m), J. Brown ($930k)*
    Signed: Alex Smith ($880k), Mike Pollak ($780k – 68 snaps)*

    Dallas
    Lost: J. Phillips ($1.75m), Jenkins ($1.5m), Butler ($1.5m), Ogletree ($1.3m)*, Coleman ($1 million - IR)
    Signed: Durant ($1.2m), Allen ($905k)*

    Detroit
    Lost: Cherilus ($6.9m), Avril ($6.5m), S. Hill ($3.8m), Durant ($1.2m)
    Signed: Quin ($4.7m), Bush ($4m), J. Jones ($3.2m)

    Green Bay
    Lost: Jennings ($9.5m), Walden ($4m)
    Signed: None

    Houston
    Lost: Barwin ($6m), Casey ($4.8m), Quin ($4.7m), Forsett ($1m), Ball ($1m), D. Jones ($905k)
    Signed: Reed ($5m), Lechler ($1.8m), G. Jones ($1m)

    New England
    Lost: Welker ($6m), Thomas ($3.5m), Chung ($3m), Woodhead ($1.8m)
    Signed: Amendola ($5.5m), Sopoanga ($3.7m), Svitek ($1m)

    New York Giants
    Lost: Bennett ($5.1m), Umenyiora ($4.25m)*, Hixon ($1.2m), Blackburn ($1m)
    Signed: Myers ($3.6m), J. Brown ($930k)*, Mundy ($780k), Murphy ($715k – 100 snaps)*

    New York Jets
    Lost: Landry ($6m), Keller ($4.3m), DeVito ($4.2m), Greene ($3.3m), Bell ($905k), Slauson ($815k)
    Signed: Goodson ($2.3m), Barnes ($1.3m)

    Oakland
    Lost: Bryant ($6.8m), Wheeler ($5.2m), Myers ($3.6m), Goodson ($2.3m), Lechler ($1.8m), Shaughnessy ($1m), Mitchell ($725k)
    Signed: Roach ($3.25m), Maiava ($2m), Walker ($2m), Sims ($1.5m), Jenkins ($1.5m), Porter ($1.2m), Hunter ($840k), Jennings ($630k)*

    Pittsburgh
    Lost: Wallace ($12m), K. Lewis ($5.1m), Mendenhall ($2.5m), Allen ($905k)*, Mundy ($780k)
    Signed: Gradkowski ($1.3m)

    St. Louis
    Lost: Amendola ($5.5m), S. Jackson ($4m), Gibson ($3.25m), Fletcher ($2.6m), Dahl ($1.75m), Turner ($1.5m)
    Signed: Long ($8.5m), Cook ($7.0m)

    San Diego
    Lost: Vasquez ($5.9m), Cason ($2m), V. Martin ($2m), Barnes ($1.3m), Jammer ($1.1m), A. Franklin ($1.1m), S. Phillips ($1m)
    Signed: Cox ($5m), Freeney ($4.4m - IR), Dunlap ($2m), Woodhead ($1.8m), J. Phillips ($1.75m), Rinehart ($1.75m), Ohrnberger ($675k)*

    San Francisco
    Lost: Goldson ($8.25m), Jean-Francois ($5.5m), Walker ($4.4m), Sopoaga ($3.7m), Ginn ($1m)
    Signed: Dorsey ($3m), Dawson ($2.4m), Dahl ($1.75m), Skuta ($1.5m)

    Tampa Bay
    Lost: Bennett ($4.8m), Miller ($2.25m), Biggers ($1.5m), Hayes ($1m)
    Signed: Goldson ($8.25m), Landri ($1.6m), Casillas ($1.4m), Ogletree ($1.3m)*

    More details

    Last year all players on full-season IR were counted. I followed that rule again this year, even though AdamJT13 noted that this was not always the case in the past.

    The following players were listed above but were not counted in compensatory pick equations for the listed reasons:

    • Mike Pollak, IND to CIN, low salary, too few snaps

    • Josh Brown, CIN to NYG, did not play full season for CIN in prior year

    • Kevin Ogletree, DAL to TB, cut before midseason

    • Will Allen, PIT to DAL, cut before midseason, signed back with PIT

    • Rich Ohrnberger, BUF to SD, low salary, too few snaps

    • Lawrence Sidbury, ATL to IND, low salary, no snaps (full season IR)

    • Rashad Jennings, JAC to OAK, low salary

    Atlanta has the most variables affecting their situation. As is mentioned above McCown had a low salary and few game snaps, but I believe that he is just over the qualification threshold. Sidbury was signed for a little less, and did not play at all, so he was not counted. It would not matter if he did count, as Atlanta reached their four-pick limit. The Falcons also signed two players coming off of “voidable” deals. Stephen Jackson voided his contract in St. Louis, and the Giants voided their contract with Osi Umenyiora. I treated Jackson as a qualified player because it was not the team’s decision to lose him. Umenyiora’s “voidable” deal was just a way to push money to the future for cap purposes, so I did not reward the team for losing him. If Jackson is not counted, it could give Atlanta another 7th round pick if they have not hit their limit. If Umenyiora counts as a signing, it would likely take away a 7th round pick, but there is a slight chance Atlanta could lose their 5th for Grimes.

    In addition to the Umenyiora situation described above, the New York Giants have a few other players that could affect their situation. Brandon Myers is consistently described as having a “voidable” contract, but in reality it is simply a deal with no guaranteed money remaining and a big salary bump in 2014 which is unlikely to get paid. Louis Murphy signed for $715,000 but barely played, so I had no problem not counting him. Ryan Mundy is the big wild card. He signed for $780,000, a relatively low amount, and played 667 snaps. I think that qualifies him as a significant contributor to the team, and with players at barely higher salaries and much fewer snaps counted in past years, I think Mundy qualifies for the comp pick equations. If he does not, the Giants would receive an extra 7th round pick.

    Oakland had a lot of activity. Rashad Jennings was a useful pickup for them, playing half of the team’s offensive snaps, but he made far below the lowest previous salary for a qualifying player. I did not count him. I did count Jason Hunter, who made more money than Ryan Mundy with a similar number of snaps, and Mike Mitchell, who was a starter for Carolina at a similar salary as Phillip Wheeler, who qualified the previous year.

    San Francisco lost players at higher salaries than they signed. Dan Skuta and Craig Dahl may be good special teams players, but you wonder whether they could have obtained good special teams players with some potential for $1 million a year less each with the 5th round comp picks that were cancelled out by their signings.

    And finally, since this is a Philly website, it's probably worth noting quickly here that the Eagles will not be rewarded a compensatory pick this year.

    Read more at http://www.philly.com/philly/blogs/...ory-pick-projections.html#DWzMP0hGcgqODMyi.99
     
    #3 NCJetsfan, Feb 8, 2014
    Last edited: Feb 8, 2014
  4. Jets4eva9011

    Jets4eva9011 Well-Known Member

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    Landry didn't net a 4th round pick? Damn..
     
  5. The Waterboy

    The Waterboy Well-Known Member

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    Landry's contract is comparable to some of the players whose former teams received a 4th rd pick last year but also not far off from some of the 5th rd comp picks.
    This list is some guys calculated guess so Landry may still be worth a 4th but his value may have been hurt by missing 4 games.
     
  6. Cakes

    Cakes Mr. Knowledge 2010

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    I think Landry will indeed net a 5th round pick, but we shall see.
     
  7. The 1985er

    The 1985er Well-Known Member

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    Getting a 5th and 3 6th round picks is awesome if true.
     
  8. Mangold Goldman

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    This isn't official you know... it's just an educated guess.

    I saw a comp pick projection from a Jets based website that projected Landry as a 4th, so we'll have to see.
     
  9. JetsNation06

    JetsNation06 Well-Known Member

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    Good thread. Let's just say they get a 5th and (3) 6th's. Probability on picks in those rounds panning out is low to begin with. However this is a chance for Idzik to pull a Seattle and really build some quality depth on this team. If the Jets can get 2 guys out of these comp picks who will become contributors on O or D then Idzik is doing some good work.
     
  10. Br4d

    Br4d 2018 Weeb Ewbank Award

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    This doesn't explain how the 49ers lost Blake Costanzo, Joshua Morgan and Madieu Williams, while signing Mario Manningham in 2012 and still got 3 comp picks, a 4th and 2 7ths. They should have gotten no more than 2 comp picks in that scenario.

    I think there's a lot more smoke in the works than even the dedicated analysts of the process think.
     
  11. FJF

    FJF 2018 MVP Joe Namath Award Winner

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    don't forget special teams, late round picks that can play teams while still providing quality backup options or spot contributions on D or O are the building blocks of a deep roster.
     
  12. displacedfan

    displacedfan Well-Known Member

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    Nice, 4 potential extra picks. Get some special teamers and maybe a gem in that bunch
     
  13. JetsNation06

    JetsNation06 Well-Known Member

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    No doubt. For once, I'd like to see the Jets nail the draft. If Idzik, Rex and the scouting dept. do their job I don't see how this can't be a really strong draft haul.
     
  14. JStokes

    JStokes Well-Known Member

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    Wow very good news. Too bad Goodson and Barnes diminished the number/rounds of picks we got considering their lack of production but that's just the way it goes I guess.

    Baltimore made out very well.

    _
     
  15. FJF

    FJF 2018 MVP Joe Namath Award Winner

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    i think the jets nailed last draft, its just going to take another year to really see it.

    as far as this goes, they have a chance to really add some depth and talent and get the ball rolling on a deep team that avoids cap issues by having replacments ready when the incumbents price their way out. 1 more good draft!
     
  16. 101GangGreen101

    101GangGreen101 2018 Thread of the Year Award Winner

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    Possibility of 11 picks, man if we could grab at least 5 starters I would be one excited Jet fan.
     
  17. FJF

    FJF 2018 MVP Joe Namath Award Winner

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    goodson and barnes have nothing to do with it. they were cut from their former teams and hence have no bearing on comp picks awarded.

    idzick was very methodical about this and is one of the reasons (cap sspace being the other) why we didn't make any major moves last year
     
  18. NCJetsfan

    NCJetsfan Well-Known Member

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    The probability of those picks not panning out is not necessarily low. Other GMs in the NFL find excellent players in those rounds. John Schneider sure does, If Idzik learned anything at all from Schneider, then if nothing else, the Jets should at least get 2-3 solid backups/role players, if not good potential starters out of these picks.
     
  19. JStokes

    JStokes Well-Known Member

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    Why does the article above mention Goodson and Barnes? I thought reading the article that somehow they impacted the comps. Why mention them if they had nothing to do with the calculation?

    _
     
  20. JetsNation06

    JetsNation06 Well-Known Member

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    He did NOT nail the 2013 draft. Outside of Richardson which was a great pick there are still a lot of question marks. Milliner still remains to be seen. He had a strong last month but was horrific the first half of the season. He needs to do it for a full year.

    Smith is far from a sure thing. Same with Winters and Ivory wasn't a draft pick.

    Nailing a draft is what Seattle has done where they got All Pro's in the late rounds. Idzik hasn't done that yet so let's not get ahead of ourselves.
     

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