First off, you are REALLY creeping me out with your takes on what my body fluids taste like. Stop it. You ignore the defense carried him. you refuse to answer what the defense was doing during Orton's era, cuz you know deep down it destroys your argument and says you are full of shit.
I LOL'ed on your first sentence... congrats on making me laugh in a good way. so I will answer you seriously this time (please do not get use to it) i have addressed the defense thing with you 1000 times ...c'mon man! One LAST time 1. Defenses are suppose to play well. 2. The defense did play well in stretches (ranked 20th in the league, it was not exactly the 85 bears but yes it allowed Denver to win those close games ) 3. The defense needed Tebow not turning the ball over like Orton in order for their good defense to stick 4. Tebow needed the defense to play well and make it a low scoring game so his style of play could flourish (beat the other opponent down and tire them out for the 4th quarter) . 5. They needed each other in order to be succesful, Tebow also needed Praeter and McGahee and the O-line and Decker and Thomas ... and they in turn needed Tebow playing that brand of ball . I say it was a team effort, you say ANYONE could have QBed those victories, even though the team was horrible and fractured in the previous 36 games!!! There is more intrinsic proof of what I am saying because we saw it actually happen. nothing I am saying is unreasonable!
So are you implying few QBs could have won those games with the Defense giving up 15 points or less per game? Or that giving up almost 30 per game as Orton played with would have still been won with Tebow. I want a direct answer to that question. Not some spin about records as if we are comparing apples to apples. Not some take on him needing everyone to help... you have been arguing that Tebow wins and Orton loses while ignoring that Tebow got help that Orton wasn't getting. When I suggest Tebow wouldn't have won without the help, as Orton didn't, or that Orton would have won with defensive help, which Tebow got... you seem to go off into the twilight zone about hatred and being upstet about the Broncos actually winning the game... :/ 7 of Tebow's 9 wins came with 15 points or less. Orton was 23 and 2. So tell me what makes you think Orton couldn't have won those games... and then tell me how Tebow would have won those games before when the defense was allowing 30? in your 1000 attempts... THAT part of the question keeps getting dodged. You never answered the question. You just revert to 11-22 or whatever it is. ...and don't say Tebow didn't turn the ball over. In the second half of his season, he was good for a fumble per game. 2 games, the other team scored with a fumble return AND an INT return (Detroit and Buffalo.) ...and punting the ball awat 11 times a game isn't what I call, "taking care of the ball" as some tried to play.
4 of tebow's 6 interceptions came in 1 quarter (or at the very least 1 half against buffalo) ....during the 7-1 streak I think he had only a few turnovers. Tebow is not perfect in any case, he is not Joe Montana, all tebow fans say is he is way better than the haters say he is and deserves a shot AND when he got his shot he made it count . I don't know what tebow would have done in those other games you mention, I only know what he ACTUALLY DID. Its hard to compare since there was a totally different offense and the Orton offense put the defense in a bad spot at the worse times. You know as well as i do , having seen all of tebow's snaps last year, that McCoy called an offense that called for punting quite a bit only to loosen it up in the 4th quarter, you might say its because they wanted to limit tebow on purpose while i say it was the wear down opponents but you make it sound like tebow was dropping back to pass all the time, he wasn't and it led to a lot of three and outs (just like it was not all tebow in the wins it was not all him in the 3 and outs) . On the flip side Denver led the NFL in rushing , from 25th place before tebow to first.( was that by magical unicorns or does tebow get some credit)? By the way as a Denver fan you are in the minority with Orton. Many tebow haters that are Denver fans admit that even though they hate Tebow they owe him some gratitude for getting rid of Orton once and for all.
I think he's implying (and he'd be correct) that Tebow was part of the reason the Defense held teams to 15 or less. Don't turn the ball over and you don't put your Defense's back against wall... It's pretty simple really. Add to the fact that with Tebow starting, the team vaulted to the NUMBER ONE RUSHING ATTACK IN THE LEAGUE! You know what that means? The more you run, the faster the clock ticks and the less your Defense is on the field. How is this so hard to understand??
I have said that until I am blue in the face, that logic has no effect on an anti tebow robot. Once they are stamped out of their robot factory that feature can not be turned off (the "I won't listen to logic" setting) must hate tebow...must hate tebow...
No, they weren't allowing that many points because of Orton putting htem in harms way. If you had sat through those games as I did, you would see even mediocre offenses marching down the field on nice looking 14 play drives. Look at hte yardage they gave up, it is only possible if teams aren't getting stopped. The defense was close to dead last, and would have been dead lost by quite a margin if the Cutler offense didn't actually stay on the field once in a while. They made JaMarcus Russell look like an all-pro one day. Yes the defense really was that horrid. Sure, I'll give credit for improving the running game. But while you were looking up the stats for where the running game was before and after... did you happen to look where the overall offense finished EVEN with the #1 in rushing ranking? They finished right around 25th overall. that tells me that while the running game looked good, it was nowhere near making up for the lack of passing. They often finished games at around 100 yards. ...and besides, most teams are built for passing anyway. Few teams run the ball as much as the Broncos did, and therefore didn't have to rely so heavily on it. Only a team that knew it couldn't pass would stick to it THAT much. ummm, actually I am not in the minority on Orton. Never did like the man, didn't want him, wasn't sold on him. Was glad he was gone. Just pointing out that given the same circumstances (defensive help) Orton's record was better than the one you boast about Tebow having when he actually got that kind of defensive help. Just illustrates my point that even a slug like Orton would succeed under those circumstances. So I'm not seeing what is so damn special about Tebow winning those games.
they were #1 because they barely did anything else. They STILL led the league in three and outs... and having your defense trotting back on the field after a break for about 3 real time minutes really isn't helping the defense at all. you're only wearing defenses down if you are keeping their defense on the field. You're not doing serious damage to the clock by run run run punt. Take the Jets game for example last year. Time of possession in that game was nearly identical. However, the Broncos defense was on the field for 15 more plays than the Jets defense was. Jets defense got to stand around in the huddle with the clock ticking. Those 15 extra plays wears down a defense far more than facing a team that runs the ball more on their way to punting any day. Running game is best when either playing with the lead, or if you are stil churning out first downs. BOTH were rare and very problematic.
@SethWalderNYDN Sparano said Tebow's package is generally about 15 plays on his card per game. #nyj that explains a lot, what are those plays? :smile:
1. Run up the middle 2. Run slightly left 3. Run slightly right 4. Run kind of up the middle 5. Run a sweep to the left 6. Run a sweep to the right 7. Fake a pass for a couple seconds, tuck it in and run. 8. Maybe a pass attempt. 9. run 10-15. More bull rushing immediately after the snap, but between different combinations of linemen.
Me, too. I was going to do a similar post, but I was tied up at work after the "15 plays" answer from Sparano came out. Concerned Citizen did a pretty good job of it, so all is well.
Sanchez Play Card: 1: Throw an INT 2: Fumble 3: Get sacked 4: Pout on the sideline after 1, 2, or 3 5: Eat a hot dog 6: Keep starting job no matter what 7: Sign elite QB valued contract extension
...and yet, Tebow still is unable to get convince the Jets coaching staff that he's the better option. Jets should take door number 3 during the next offseason like the Broncos did and just get a real QB and stop experimenting with running backs playing out of position.
That's like saying a black man is at fault for not being able to convince the KKK to accept him as a member.
