You are not winning a SB in this league unless you can make a game changing throw into a tight window at some point. That's out of design based on ability. Sometimes your guy makes the play sometimes the defender makes the play. Not being able to make that throw and not throwing picks because you're a running back playing QB doesn't make you an efficient QB. Good teams don't want to win every game by 3 points. When you let bad teams hang around good things and bad things can happen. When you play really good teams under playoff conditions plays have to be made, tight throws have to be made or defenders have to step up. Having a QB who doesn't throw picks because he has a crappy arm, bad release and can't throw into a tight window doesn't make him efficient.
Actually, iirc, Brady and the Pats would have won the SB if he had hit the WIDE OPEN Wes Welker Contrary to popular belief, the NFL isn't always about tight windows.
1. That's the most retarded statement I have heard to try to knock on someone's rushing average. 2. Mark Sanchez played 16 regular season games. Tebow played 11, but I love how some people continue to ignore that. And no it doesn't mean Tebow scores more, it means he scores more efficiently without making as many costly mistakes.
Very true and what Pats fans have to live with is Brady missed 2 wide open throws but even with that the other QB made a few throws into extremely tight windows to pull it out.
Thanks. Reading a lot of statistics is nice, but everyone here is smart enough to start showing how misguided these stats are trying to paint a better picture of Tebow. Like I said multiple times, these stats are all being manipulated. The main thing to take from this is that if you take away Tebow's 125 snaps from 2010-2011 where he wasn't a starting QB, his TD/TO ration drops .4 points. This means he was very effective in his rookie year where he was used situationally, as the Jets are planning to use him. If he becomes the starting QB, the Jets have major problems. I would love to be wrong about this, but I don't see a scenario where he takes over this year and the Jets are successful
I'm sorry did Tom Brady win the Superbowl this year even if he set a completion passing record IN the super bowl? No, his safety, because of his inability to do what Tebow does and throw the ball away PROPERLY, as well as his interception, did have a lot to do with losing the Super Bowl and his 60%+ completion percentage didn't save him, did it? But no the elite passer didn't win it, it was the guy who scrambles and throws it up to an elite receiver that won, TWICE! And for the record it was the guy who DIDN'T turn over the ball! Was the Super Bowl 35-30? No, it was 21-17. I think Tebow would have managed just fine. Superbowl is no different than ANY other football game. Anyone can win one once you get there. The hard part is making it and Tebow got a lot closer last year than the other 20 some quarterbacks. And if you do wanna talk about playoffs and Superbowl, then the simple fact that teams get more conservative, which is usually what kills pass happy teams, playing out of their element, then I think guys like Tebow will prove to do just fine. But you wanna continue talking about perception over reality?
What elite receiver are you talking about? There was no elite receiver on the field during the superbowl. Also who did Eli just throw it up to this year? His best play was standing still in the pocket and throwing a picture perfect pass to Mario Manningham on the sideline. Nothing like you described. And funny stat you obviously overlooked, the QB that threw for 60% did not win, but the QB that threw for 75% did. Funny how you missed that. The same QB that only rushed once all game for -1 yards. But you keep on throwing misleading stats. Oh and Eli was a very very good passer this year. Maybe not elite, but very good and top 7 in the league this year. Maybe top 5.
He threw a standard side line pass which you see thrown a million times a season, and I've seen Tebow do the same thing including against the Steelers. In the last Super Bowl Eli scrambled, and lobbed it up in quadruple coverage for a miracle catch by Tyree. There was nothing surgical about it. Actually I think Tebow makes those throws look a lot better. And my point is the QB who's considered to be the best in the game, didn't win. He got beat by the guy's who's still struggling to be considered part of that category despite his 2 Superbowl wins because of the misconception created by retarded stats. Just a bunch of cliche sayings people throw around. You gotta have this, you gotta have that to win a superbowl. Defense wins championships. All a bunch of made up crap. It's just another football game, and more often than not winning a superbowl comes down to luck just as much as skill. And there's nothing misleading about a quarterback's career TD % or TO %. They are what they are.
The better QB won the last super bowl. He played better than Brady, not sure where you are going with it. And no that pass to Manningham was not standard. Please watch and see how beautifully placed that pass was. In between the safety and CB. [YOUTUBE]XP0Q5I0vgS4[/YOUTUBE]
First off, stop being annoying. You changed this post: Second off, you are over-valuing the running effectiveness of quarterbacks. Even the best of the best, Michael Vick, under the hypest of circumstances, could only reach the conference championship. This is a passer's league. Tim Tebow is a dying elephant when it comes to quarterback play. But he can be used as the secret weapon a number of times this year and the Jets will get their worth out of that trade. You are talking like an advocate of the collegiate game. Learn something about the Pro game. Rushing quarterbacks get their asses handed to them.
I've seen it a million times, and yes, it is standard. It's an over the shoulder outside pass only his receiver catches or it goes out of bound. It's the first thing you are taught as a quarterback. I've seen a million passes just like that in the NFL, including yes, from Tim Tebow. They come down more to the receiver's ability to extend, catch, and get his feet in bounds. There's nothing all that amazing about it other than it being in a Super Bowl. You should watch more football. If you ask me Brady made much more impressive passes that game.
40 yards on rope in the air. That was the most impressive throw all game. Brady made not single throw near that. In fact he was very inaccurate on any throw that went over 20+ yard in the air. Didn't complete a single one. I like how you dodge the fact there was no elite receiver on the field like you originally stated and that Manning completed 75% of his passes all game.
Your statement about stringing together games without interceptions is not correct. The fact that Sanchez averages 1 INT every 30 throws while Tebow averages 1 INT every 40 throws doesn't mean that at the start of each game the counter goes back to 0 and Tebow gets an extra 10 throws "for free"; it means that in any consecutive stretch of 30 (40) throws the expected number of INTs is 1, including going over multiple games. The standard model for a count variable like the number of interceptions is the Poisson distribution. Based on that distribution, the probability that a QB with a 3.3% INT percentage would throw 30 times and have 0 INTs is .37, while the corresponding probability for a QB with a 2.5% INT percentage is .47, so in either case there is more than an even chance of at least one INT. The probabilities that a QB would have two consecutive games without an INT are .14 and .22, respectively, so it would be very unlikely that either QB would string together a number of games without an interception if they threw 30 times each game. There's no question that turnovers matter, but the expected effect might be less than some people realize. This link uses five years worth of NFL data to come up with an additional .2 wins associated with an additional turnover holding all else fixed. Since .8 higher INT rate and 30 passes per game translates into an expected number if INTs that is about 4 higher, that says that a team having a QB with an INT rate that is .8 higher is associated with having an expected number of wins that is about 1 higher holding all else fixed. Of course, it is the "holding all else fixed" that matters, especially in this situation, since one would expect that the entire dynamic of the offense would be different using Sanchez versus Tebow, especially since Tebow is quite unusual in having both a relatively low interception rate (which is good) and an extremely low completion rate (which is bad). I think this article from last December says a lot of reasonable things about these questions. Interestingly, it was written right before the 1-4 finish for Tebow, when he had a 7-1 record as a starter. It points out that it is very difficult to keep winning when you're being outscored (they didn't), it is impossible to keep an interception rate of 1.5%, which his was at the time (he didn't; it went up to 3.3% over the last 5 games), and it is very unlikely a QB will have a good career when their completion percentages are so low at the very beginning (pretty much only Drew Bledsoe, Eli Manning, and Kerry Collins have done it in the past 20 years; the other QBs at the level of his numbers are people like Mike McMahon, Heath Shuler, Ryan Leaf, Anthony Wright, Akili Smith, Browning Nagle, Craig Erickson, Craig Whelihan, and Joey Harrington). It also points out what I view as pretty much the only reason to think Tebow could be different, that his playing style is very different from that of any QB who has appeared in the NFL in the past 20 years, so comparisons with other players aren't necessarily very meaningful.
You are out of your mind. That was not a standard sideline pass. That was a throw that threaded the needle between 2 defenders and allowed Manningham the ability to get both feet in bounds. That is a throw that Tebow couldn't make in his wildest fantasy.
Wait a second. I'm confused. Are you changing your tune about deep throws being more difficult than short, tight window throws? Because it sure seems like people are using a double standard depending on who we are talking about. Which one is it? And Victor Cruz isn't an elite receiver? Hakeem Nicks? Ok my bad... And if you like deep bombs what's wrong with these? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PhiOp4U0l5Y&feature=related Would they not count in a SuperBowl because they're being thrown by Tim Tebow? 51 yards pass across the field 35 yard tight rope to the right side line, perfectly thrown for a touchdown.(same exact type of throw that Eli made, but it was for a TD, on the opposite side of the field). 58 yard over the middle And of course the pass in OT everyone knows about. That's a lot of perfectly thrown bombs in one game for a QB who can't pass...
You have a very loose term of elite then. Calvin, Andre, Fitz are elite WR's, that is it. If they can demand double coverage and beat it, they are elite. Not changing tune because I didn;t use length of throw as the only factor on making it difficult. The 40 yards plus how tight of a window plus the two defenders plus the sideline plus backed up in your own endzone, very difficult throw. Also if we go way back to the point your making you would see I said deep throws down the middle of the field on one on one coverage are easy. Especially if you throwing ahead of a fast receiver. This throw was on the sideline and there is no room for error compared to throwing over the middle of the field where your WR beat the safety. You are twisting words to try to fight a losing argument, and avoinding my points
