not to deviate but I've been on messing on forums since about 2003 and never have I seen a thread get so many replies in such a short amount of time this is one heated topic :beer: cheers, carry on
A player who does not fulfill his contract is barred from signing with other teams in the NFL. Darrelle Revis contract does not say that he can opt out in 4 years. It says that he can opt out after completing 4 seasons of work for the Jets. That just is what it is. The Jets won't let him opt out of the contract until he makes a good faith effort to complete it to the point at which the opt out provision triggers. He can't sit out this season and still fulfill the contract, any more than he could have sat out the last 3 plus this one and completed it. He's under contract to the Jets until he fulfills the contract. No player has ever successfully walked away from an uncompleted contract and made a deal for himself anywhere in the NFL. A couple have convinced teams to trade them away in that situation but nobody has walked free with obligations left unfulfilled. Point one out if you think I am wrong. Just give us an example of a player who failed to complete a year in his contract in a holdout situation and was allowed to sign with another NFL team.
Point to the CBA restriction that says you are right. I just cited a reference, one respected on this board for the most part, that says Revis can void his deal at the end of the season. So far, every source writing about Revis' contract has said that the only thing he can lose is his $1 million salary for the season and his UFA status, something he really doesn't care about. You, on the other hand, have cited absolutely nothing. Post the article or shut the fuck up.
Are you an agent? This post is so ignorant and one-sided it is hard to believe. Please remember that this is football, not baseball and the Jets are not the Yankees. When a CBA is signed, the salary cap will be back in place and if the Jets start to pay everybody on the team as much as they demand and more than any other players at their respective positions, how long before they reach the cap and can't field a competitive team? As for what a player deserves - there is no formula for that. Revis does not deserve $16 million just because the Raiders paid Asomaghu $15 million a year in a fit of stupidity, especially when you consider that the rest of the top CBs in the NFL are paid in the $9-10 million a year range. Why is it that Houston can manage to sign Andre Johnson, who is probably the best WR in the NFL (and who has performed at that level for more than one season), the Pats can sign Brady (I heard he signed today), but the Jets can't sign Revis after only three years in the NFL and one great season? It has nothing to do with what he deserves or what he is truly worth. It has to do with his asshole of an agent and Revis' ego demanding that he be paid more than Asomugha. Why is Mangold in camp and Revis not? Why is Manning in camp and Revis not? Why are Jackson and Revis holding out? Who is their agent? There is your answer.
The Darrelle Revis Holdout Thread Fair enough, but still interpretation and assumption. I'm just tired of the unilateral assertions that he has automatically lost his right to void or will lose his right to void. The Jets will certainly be able to challenge that if it comes down to it, but it's foolhardy to assume that the right has been stripped without hearing it from someone with direct knowledge of the contractual terms. So far as I understood, the only provision was met, and the option to void triggered for after the 2010 season. The RFA argument is irrelevant at this point. The void triggers after the Super Bowl, but before the end of the 2010 season. Until a new CBA is reached, there are NO rules governing free agency, so we have little idea what those rules will look like.
Standard NFL contract, clause 16: http://www.thehogs.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=392237 "16. EXTENSION. Unless this contract specifically provides otherwise, if Player becomes a member of the Armed Forces of the United States or any other country, or retires from professional football as an active player, or otherwise fails or refuses to perform his services under this contract, then this contract will be tolled between the date of Player’s induction into the Armed Forces, or his retirement, or his failure or refusal to perform, and the later date of his return to professional football. During the period this contract is tolled, Player will not be entitled to any compensation or benefits. On Player’s return to professional football, the term of this contract will be extended for a period of time equal to the number of seasons (to the nearest multiple of one) remaining at the time the contract was tolled. The right of renewal, if any, contained in this contract will remain in effect until the end of any such extended term." There's other stuff in there that applies also, such as the NFL's ability to restrict movement among teams based on agreements between the teams and the league, but clause 16 is the one that ties Revis to the Jets until he performs for them. I should add that I think you need a timeout here. Why don't you go post in another thread for awhile because you seem to be becoming unduly upset by the other people posting in the thread. It's not good for your blood pressure to be getting angry at things people say that are not directed at you. In fact it's not good for your blood pressure to become angry at all but that's a topic for another day.
The Darrelle Revis Holdout Thread I haven't seen his contract, so I can't comment. I've only heard of one provision trigger, and it was met. I can tell you that the only NFL contract I've actually seen had the salaries scheduled by year, not numbered season of service. Agreed, but no one said he's fulfilling the contract. It becomes muddled with the void/buyback, as he's technically not fulfilling the final two years. I'd actually imagine that if the Jets didn't buy back his last two years, he'd become something of an ERFA. He has no capability to simply walk away anyway. The Jets can control him for three more seasons if they choose to. Like I said, I could see him becoming an ERFA.
Clause 16 is part of the standard NFL contract. I guess it's possible that standard clauses were removed from Revis contract but I don't see why the Jets would have removed that one.
Ignorant? You seem to think that the ownership has the right to lowball players and that players are bad guys for wanting to be paid what the market has prescribed to them. The Jets loaded themselves with top-end talent for a season. You really didn't expect them to be able to keep all of these players on one team, did you? Every expiring contract, be it Revis, Cromartie, Edwards, Holmes, Harris or Mangold belongs to a player who has the potential to put himself in the top five - some even the top three - in their position if they aren't already there. The players you mentioned are not all going to be Jets after 2010. They're going to be top end free agents. If they don't become top end free agents, it will be because they had terrible seasons. That's why the Jets have a scouting department, free agency and the draft. We'll be lucky to keep four of the above, three is slightly more realistic. Unless someone wants to take a pay cut, we can retain the core four and that's probably it. You're fooling yourself if you think otherwise. I know, that's why contract negotiations exist. Technically, he asked for $.50 more than Asomugha so $16million is a bit of a stretch. Houston and New England aren't owned by Woody Johnson. Bob Kraft, despite employing the biggest asshole coach in the NFL, has a history of paying his top talent top dollar to return. That's why Brady is still there. That's why Woolfork is still there. That's why Richard Seymour got a nice new contract when his rookie contract expired. As for Houston, Bob McNair better be paying the most exciting player on his team. They have had one winning season in their eight years of existance, and it was only a 9-7 season at that. Then again, they are just one player on a team. It's not like Brady, Mayo, Moss, Welker, Woolfork and Mankins are all on expiring contracts right now. It's his choice. Maybe he's trying to help out his teammate by not adding any more pressure. This is a difficult situation the Jets are facing. I said the top players on the team, if they play to their potential, have the right to ask for what they are worth and deserve to be paid such. I never said that it should be the Jets that will paying all of them. I realize that there are some players that I love on this team that won't be coming back if they have great seasons because the Jets cannot afford to keep all of them. If we do sign Revis then we probably won't bring back Cromartie, but then again, isn't that why we drafted Kyle Wilson in the first place? Santonio and Braylon won't be playing more than one season in Green and White together. They are both #1 WRs and Santonio sure as Hell isn't going to want to play as a #2 or #3 again in his career. He can start for 32/32 teams in this league. He will play second or third fiddle this season for the Jets but once his contract is up, the Jets are going to have to choose between him and Edwards. One is going to get a deal with the Jets and the other will get a deal somewhere else. But please, blame everything on the agents.
ERFA are limited to players with less than 3 years service under the current CBA. I don't think he winds up there since he has the 3 years. I think he winds up as an RFA assuming that he and the Jets can get to that point. Obviously it's in the Jets best interests to buy back the 2 years if they think he will play for them. It might well be in their best interests to let him go as an RFA if they have been unable to trade him due to the contract situation. Neither Belichik or Parcells is going to sign a cornerback to a huge contract, even to hurt the Jets, and they'd get back the 1st and 3rd in that scenario which would be preferable to an endless holdout from Revis.
The Darrelle Revis Holdout Thread Just read it. Thanks. I'm not saying there's no protection in his contract, but it wouldnt be as simple as Clause 16 given the void and its impact on salary structure. That's an awfully short and simple contract, whereas the Revis contract was incredibly convoluted. There must be some provision in it to protect against the current situation, and I'd love to see it to know what we're dealing with here: something that specifically pushes the void back, or simply an extension of the Jets' rights to Revis at the end of the deal. Given the indications that the void was a fixed date, not fixed season, it could well be the latter.
I believe it cost him an accrued season with regards becoming a free-agent. It did not cost him an accrued season with regards to fulfilling his fourth year of service on his contract. If I can find a link I will.
The Darrelle Revis Holdout Thread I know. The first time I said "something like an ERFA". I neglected to re-state that the second time. I don't think it will reach the point at which he becomes an RFA, although we discussed that possibility a few days ago. Personally, I don't see many ways out of this that don't involve a long term contract with the Jets. Little else seems ultimately tenable for both sides.
I don't know. It seems pretty simple to me: Revis owes the Jets a year at a million. If he doesn't play that year in 2010 he likely has to play it in 2011. I think we're in uncharted waters at this point though because tolling has only been used in situations in the past in which the franchise tag is where the player was sitting, which is kind of no test of the clause at all. Revis is trying effectively to fight his way out of his rookie contract and if he succeeds the effect on the rest of the NFL will likely be devastating. There are many players who outplay their rookie deals by a lot. Establishing the precedent that holding out can get you out of that contract several years early would change the nature of talent management in the NFL.
Excuse me for not jumping at your call massa. You, BTW, have not posted anything in this thread that I've seen that was worth anything to the discussion at all. You're a Revis fanboi and every post you make is either a personal attack on somebody who is not or factually incorrect when examined on it's merits. Often both.
