Actually, THIS is what I was arguing against: I wasn't saying that I took offense to you thinking they SHOULD trade him, my opinion of which depends on the deal offered. I was saying that I disagreed that you could say with certainty that this "will be Washington's last year with the Jets - no matter what." Leon's coming off a horrible injury, and his return to form is highly questionable. I'm interested to see what kind of deal he's actually offered. I'm not sure ANYONE offers him solid money in a standard contract because of the injury. If someone puts a creative contract together to hedge against his injury (the 30% rule only applies to players we can't sign under the F8P anyway), it might be worth considering. For example, if he's offered a contract that's heavy on incentives with a late roster bonus, who is to say the Jets don't take the chance, which would then lock him up for multiple years? To be perfectly honest, I'll be happy if they keep him without overpaying and I'll be happy if we get a pick and turn one of our first picks into a solid power back. I'm certainly not going to suggest that I know the thinking of the Jets and 31 other teams.
Think about it. You really think the Jets are going to bring a backup player back over important players like Mangold, Revis, Edwards, Ferguson, and potentially Cromartie?
Remember the tender offer just the staring point of the negotiations. At the end of the day it doesn't mean Leon will be had for that price. Especially if the negotiating team's second round pick is a high one.
I'm fine with taking the 49ers 2nd rounder in exchange for Leon. Picking up a 34 year old Faulk though from the Pats? Eh, not so much
For what it's worth, Barber listed at 205 prior to the 1999 season. That's the oldest factual info I have. Going off memory, I think he was at least 190 when he entered the league. Is it possible that he weighed 195 and the Giants inflated the number to 203 for some reason? Maybe. It happens often with high school football and sometimes in college, but not often in the NFL unless it's some 330+ pounder whose weight fluctuates on a daily basis.
Yeah I'm sure that number is off but not by more than 20 pounds as Mr. E would suggest. Also players weight tend to fluctuate between their last year in college and the draft. Skill players who are considered too light try to bulk up and overweight linemen try to slim down for their critics.
No, but I also don't think the two are mutually exclusive, nor do I consider Leon to be a pure backup player. The league is RBBC, and certain factors have to happen before Leon becomes expendable. The $3 million I mentioned before certainly doesn't kill our future cap number or our future negotiations. We've all assumed that the Jets will be looking at a RB in the 1st two rounds, but who is to say they DON'T keep Leon and look for depth later on? We have no clue what they're thinking in that regard. We assume that Greene will step in to the 'feature' back role (whatever that means anymore), but his shaky injury history leaves that uncertain as well. If Leon goes without an offer and rejects our deals again this offseason, and if Greene steps into his role and holds up over a season of punishment, I think Leon walks. If a team gives him a contract that would make our future salary situation untenable, I think he walks. If, however, the team feels his rehab is going well and sees him as an important part of our running game next season and beyond, and if he either receives a decent offer or receives NO offer and takes that as a sign his market value isn't as high as he thought...I think he gets his 4 year deal. It's funny...I'll check, but I'm fairly certain I've seen you preach the prevalence of RBBC in this league several times. It isn't until we're talking about Leon and it supports your point that you're willing to call him a 'backup'.
I do talk about RBBCs all the time. I don't think he's as valuable as a lot of posters seems to think. Me calling him a backup has nothing to do with my supporting my point. Washington is a damn backup. If the Jets decided to keep Jones, Washington would've been the third option at running back on this team. If the Jets draft a back within the first two rounds, Washington will be the third option on this team. Washington doesn't fit into this scheme. This powerful, clock controlling scheme doesn't have a need for an overpaid check down option that occasionally makes a few plays. I'll admit that I've thrown Leon Washington under the bus. My opinion of him changed when he demanded big money and didn't deserve it. It also changed when I saw the offensive philosophy under Rex Ryan. I believe this team needs a stable of power running backs.
Uh, no offense, but I'm certainly not on your side here. Leon for a 3rd is horribly unlikely, nor do I think there's any comparison between him and Barber. EDIT: Also, Jahvid Best can lick my balls. Fuck him. (Previous comment subject to change if we draft him)
Disagree. I think we're better suited with a bruiser/power back and a speed guy like we have/had in LW. Break down the defense early with power runs up the gut and then try to burn them outside the hashes. Our line is good so we have options.
And, like I said, if Greene holds up and we draft a back, I think Leon's gone. I don't think we disagree with the reasoning for Leon being gone. I'm just not as certain as you are that the team is necessarily heading in that direction. I'm not sure exactly what our offense will look like this season. I know we shifted to a power running team when Leon went down...and now Jones is gone. I know we tried to put the ball in Sanchez's hands after a successful first few games...and had to shift our approach again when he faltered. I'm just not all that sure that he doesn't fit into the team's plans. If you could tell me that Gerhart was available and was the pick with our Leon-acquired 2nd rounder, I'd bid Leon farewell. I just don't have any clue what the front office is thinking right now.
If you want a guy like Leon, why would you want the 49ers' 2nd rounder? We're not likely going to get a guy like Leon in the 2nd round. If we're taking a RB there, it's either a power back or it's Jahvid Best.
Those 200 yards and 3 TDs from 2008 still sting, huh? (I felt the same way after Reggie Bush completely destroyed Fresno in 2005)
Doesn't necessarily have to be the 2nd round pick, but then again I'm not well versed in the draft. 3rd/4th round would work.
That isn't what the Jets are trying to do. We're trying to physically beat down our opponent's defense with our running game. Shonn Greene is capable of breaking off big runs and he's a power back. We're not going to run the ball outside much. We're a between the tackle type of team.
Understood, I just personally prefer a pure speed/agility back paired with 1 or 2 power backs. It's nice to have that potential home-run hitter in the backfield and on ST. (assuming the back does KR/PR)
I honestly have no clue what the front office is up to either, but getting something out of a player who more than likely won't be here in 2011 is a good idea. I just a have a good feeling the Jets are looking to go running back early in this draft. According to a lot of reports, Washington isn't completely healthy yet. So, the Jets have to have some sort of plan installed to bring in another back. They wouldn't have let Thomas Jones go if that wasn't the case.
I know what you're saying, and that style of offense is a damn good way to play football...I just don't think it will be the Jets' style. Washington was definitely a threat as a kick returner, but so was Brad Smith. I think Westoff deserves a lot of credit for the big plays this return team makes.
